Originally posted by Rajk999
In the light of the fact that the 'Jesus is God' argument is still raging on I would like to add a passage that seems very confusing to the arguments of both camps.
Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
This speaks of the incarnation of God as a man to be our Redeemer, Savior, Lord and life.
In the process of God dispensing Himself into man, along the way, economically God was incarnated as a human. You read it - "And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us ..." (John 1:14)
That is the Word that was with God and was God (John 1:1)
For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee?
Only two angels are mentioned by name in the Scripture - Gabriel and Michael. The answer has to be "To NO angel did God ever say that".
One exception could be "the Angel of Jehovah"
which a number of times is synonymous with God Himself.
And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son? And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
I don't see a problem so far contradicting that God incarnated as a man in His economy to dispense Himself into His redeemed and justified believers.
And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire. But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God,
This passage is a bases of the expression "God the Son".
The Son of God here is spoken of as being God - period.
is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
This portion reveals that the man is God and the man has God.
This is consisted with Him having "fellows"
He is one of us yet He is also God - the Son.
God became a man so that we might become God, not in His Godhead, but we may become God by way of being His "many sons"
being brought into the glorious expression of the Divine Being.
As Hebrews says:
"For it was fitting for Him, for who are all things and through whom are all things, in leading many sons into glory, to make the Author [or Captain, Originator, Inaugarator, Leader, Pioneer] of their salvation perfect through suffering.
For both He who sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of One, for which cause He is not ashamed to call them brothers." (Hebrews 2:10,11)
God who became man like us has fellows
. And He is leading these fellows
, these many other sons of God into the glorious expression of the eternal life. That is the God expressed in being mingled with humanity.
He, being God the Son, has justified and redeemed His people. He is sanctifying them and leading them as the REAL Joshua - the Captain of salvation.
He is among man yet anointed with an exultant joy unique to Himself alone as the one Redeemer. He is anointed "above His fellows"
As God and man He is in our midst declaring "the Father"
in the midst of the church -
... " I will declare Your name [the name Father] to my brothers; in the midst of the church I will sing hymns of praise to You."
The Godman, Jesus Christ, is in the midst of us, the ekklesia (the church), for He is man as we are men. He is the object of our worship. Yet He is also the Captain of our salvation, one with us, leading us as Joshua led Israel into the Good Land.
And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands: They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment; And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail. But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool? (Hebrews 1:4-13 KJV)
It is amazing that the writer of the book of Hebrews would not flinch in the least from applying these words from Psalm 102:25-27
to Jesus Christ. This proves without a doubt that the writer of Hebrews, under inspiration, is teaching that the Creator of the universe is Christ.
But then again without the Word nothing that has come into being would have apart from Christ.
My personal view is that because the issue is so confusing I would rather just stick with what Christ and all the Apostles said ie that he is the Son of God - a separate and distinct entity from, and subject to, His Father.
Where is Christ "SEPARATE" from His Father in this passage?
"Phillip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father and it is sufficient for us.
Jesus said to him, Have I been so long a time with you, and you have not known Me, Phillip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how is it that you say, Show us the Father? (John 14:8,9)
The Father and the Son are here distinct. But they are not separate. For, Phillip says "Lord, show us the Father ..."
. And Jesus said - "Have I been so long a time with you, AND YOU HAVE NOT KNOWN ME, Phillip?
Think about this.
" Lord show us the Father ..."
" Have I been so long a time with you, and you have not known Me, Phillip?"
So where here is your "mandatory" separation between the Father and Jesus the Son of God ? The Father lives in the Son and the Son lives in the Father, as explained in His next sentence -
"Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak from Myself, but the Father who abides in Me does His works." (v.10)
Using a little imagination we might even imagining Jesus saying -
"Phillip, don't you remember Isaiah 9:6
? Didn't the prophet already tell you that the Son given would be called the Eternal Father? Were you not already told that the child born would be the Mighty God and the Son given would be the Eternal Father in Isaiah 9:6
? How do you say to the Son to show you the Father? For over three years now that is exactly what I have been doing. Don't you know Me yet Phillip ?"