Don't be too hard on yourself

Originally posted by divegeester
So is that a yes or a no..

Faith without works is dead?

Didn't I agree that "that is what it says" ?

Faithwithout works is dead - yes, yes, yes.

But praise God Jesus is never dead.

Originally posted by sonship
Didn't I agree that [b]"that is what it says" ?

Faithwithout works is dead - yes, yes, yes.

But praise God Jesus is never dead.[/b]

So, someone with faith but no works is not "saved" because the faith is dead, right?

Originally posted by FMF
So, someone with faith but no works is not "saved" because the faith is dead, right?

it is not profitable to me to take out an electron microscope and try to get down to the tiny, tiny line showing "How dead in faith can I be?"

I anticipated that after I said "Amen" to James that "faith without works is dead" you or someone else would immediately see if one could pinpoint just how dead in faith one can be and still be saved.

This is not a profitable use of a Christian's time.

In my thread on Helps in Reading the Bible I encouraged people to say "Amen", " So Be It " or "That's right dear God" to everything the Bible says. One should guard from the temptation of not liking some passages, or suppressing some passages in favor of others.

The greatest way of blessing is to just "Amen" the word of God. Amen Lord Jesus, faith without works is dead. Lord I just say "And So It Is" I just "Amen" Your word. You try to touch the Holy Spirit in taking in the word of God - always, He is there if your heart is turned to the Lord.

As a skeptical person your priority may be to then hold the Christian's conviction up to a microscope to see if some illogic or inconsistency can be detected.

Paul tells the Christians that not only faith without works is dead but to set the mind on the flesh is death.

"For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the spirit is life and peace." (Romans 8:6)

He is talking to Christians. Set the mind on the human spirit where the Spirit of Christ has come to dwell. To set the mind instead on the natural man that we all inherited from Adam, the flesh, spiritually "is death". It doesn't matter if you're forgiven and are saved. To set the mind on the natural man, the fallen man, the Adamic nature, the flesh - "is death". But to set the mind on the spirit where the Spirit of Jesus indwells, "is life and peace".

James is saying something similar - "Faith without works is dead". It is not so profitable for the Christian to pursue so intensely "Well if that is the case, How dead is dead? How dead can I be ??"

Originally posted by sonship
it is not profitable to me to take out an electron microscope and try to get down to the tiny, tiny line showing "How dead in faith can I be?"

I anticipated that after I said [b] "Amen" to James that "faith without works is dead" you or someone else would immediately see if one could pinpoint just how dead in faith one can be and still be s ...[text shortened]... istian to pursue so intensely "Well if that is the case, How dead is dead? How dead can I be ??"[/b]

You sound a bit like Clinton saying "It depends on what the meaning of the word is is".

Originally posted by sonship
As a skeptical person your priority may be to then hold the Christian's conviction up to a microscope to see if some illogic or inconsistency can be detected.

I engage you because "illogic and inconsistency" has been detected, not in order to find it.

Originally posted by FMF
You sound a bit like Clinton saying "It depends on what the meaning of the word is is".

He is a preacher of dead faith - faith without works.
Living faith is what Jesus wants, so clearly his doctrine is not of Christ.
His garbage doctrine stinks for miles and anyone with some basic knowledge can spot it.

Plus all the other foolishness that he speaks of
- eternal torment for all non Christians
- Christians watching as people are tormented
- continuing with sin and still being acceptable to God
- eating and drinking Christ means .. whatever' .. but not in the Bible.

The guy is joker.

Originally posted by FMF
You sound a bit like Clinton saying "It depends on what the meaning of the word is is".

You take the word of God, you say "Amen" in a praying spirit to every word. You let the Holy Spirit not only give you the logos but the rhema that applies intimately to your personal walk.

Amen Lord. Faith without works is dead. Amen Lord Jesus. But You Lord are the Living One. Lord You are living forever and ever. Lord You have the keys of death and Hades. Lord You are the Life. Lord in You is Life. Lord You came that we might have life and have it abundantly.

Lord Jesus save me from faith without works, dear Lord. I want to be living. You are living. I don't want to be different from You Lord. You don't want me to be different from You. Make me living Lord. Infuse me with Yourself as my life.

That is how I pray over such a passage like this in James, or any other passage for that matter.

Originally posted by sonship
You take the word of God, you say [b]"Amen" in a praying spirit to every word. You let the Holy Spirit not only give you the logos but the rhema that applies intimately to your personal walk.[/b]

Huh? Do you not get the Clinton reference ~ or how it is apt in view of your previous post?

So what in James might we notice is related to the OP ?

Again James encourages the believers in Christ to confess their failures to one another that they may be healed.

"Therefore confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed."

The Christian can be missing some substantial remedy and healing simply because he is isolated too much. They may look at all these imperfect Christian brothers and sisters and imaging themselves to be superior. They may imagine that all are imperfect and none can be trusted.

The Christian should at least have some two or three or more whom they can confess that they need to overcome this or that besetting problem. The horizontal relationship should not be abandoned for only a vertical relationship with God.

These dusty brothers and sisters in Christ are received by Jesus just like you have been received. Find one or two that I can confess to.

"Bothers, I am really weak in this area. Brothers, I can't seem to get through here. I open up to you brothers to confess my weakness here. Please petition the Lord for me."

This is related to the OP -

Originally posted by sonship
So what in James might we notice is related to the OP ?

Again James encourages the believers in Christ to confess their failures to one another that they may be healed.

Maybe he meant 'Faith without works is dead but it's OK you can just confess your failures and then it's not dead'?

If that is indeed what he meant, one wonders why he didn't say it.

Originally posted by sonship
You take the word of God, you say [b]"Amen" in a praying spirit to every word. You let the Holy Spirit not only give you the logos but the rhema that applies intimately to your personal walk.

Amen Lord. Faith without works is dead. Amen Lord Jesus. But You Lord are the Living One. Lord You are living forever and ever. Lord You have the key ...[text shortened]... how I pray over such a passage like this in [b]James, or any other passage for that matter.[/b]

More mouth worship.

Ignore the meaning of what James says and just say Amen Lord Jesus, Amen... and its all ok to return to preaching your false doctrine... hilarious !!

When I write "Don't be too hard on yourself" I do not mean for the Christian to be loose and sloppy. I mean some things it seems God will not let you overcome on your own.

The building up of Christians with one another to form His Body is on His heart. I am not sure if God cannot or simply will not let us all get through individually. Whether He cannot or will not we can argue maybe in eternity. But for sure He DOES NOT.

Now there are in history certain spiritual giants that God raised up to help the church. For instance George Mueller was a man of great prayers and answers to prayer. He is an example to believers of one depending on God for all kinds of practical support.

I am convinced that God does not want us all to be like George Mueller, a giant of faith in prayers and answers to prayers. Other spiritual "giants" have come and gone to be lessons to the Christians.

But God's purpose is not fulfilled in many individual spiritual giants.

There may be rubies and diamonds and sapphires and emeralds and other individual gem stones which are good for display. But the New Jerusalem is a built up house of precious stones all related to one another.

Here's a better way. If you have a besetting failure that you cannot overcome you take it to some trusted Christian brothers or sisters. Even if there is one or maybe two, you take the problem to them. You have the attitude -

"Lord Jesus, this help that I need is not just for me to be victorious in an individual way. This help that I need accomplishes YOUR plan to build me up with other believers. Lord Jesus I need grace in this matter not just so I can be without problems. But YOU, Lord, have a need to build me up with others into Your Body, into Your living temple. This little gathering here is for Your plan Lord."

This is turning our private matter into what it really is all about. God needs a Body for Christ. God needs a living temple to be built up for His return. You know that He will honor this kind of seeking FIRST ... His kingdom and His righteousness.

All other things which we need will be added to us then. That's what Jesus taught.

Originally posted by sonship
So what in [b]James might we notice is related to the OP ?

Again James encourages the believers in Christ to confess their failures to one another that they may be healed.

"Therefore confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed."

The Christian can be missing some substantia ...[text shortened]... s to confess my weakness here. Please petition the Lord for me."

This is related to the OP -[/b]

Yep .. again. Just confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians... confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians... confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians... confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians... confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians... confess your sins and say Amen and more Amen Lord and over and over and then continue with the same old sins.. for the next week or so. The go to the meeting with other fellow Christians...

Boy o boy .. Jesus will have fun with you guys on judgment day 😀

At what point is it not ok to continue doing that same thing over and over and repeating the same thing over and over. At what point would you preach to people and tell them to change their ways....

It is a fact, a sad one, that some who set out to love Jesus dreamed of being maybe spiritual giants. When they had some bad failure they became either too despondent or bitter.

Some dreamed of being very useful Christian workers and had some humiliating defeat. Afterwards they may even have become so bitter that they were annoyed with other Christians for years.

It is my opinion that some who sought to be Christians may or may not have been regenerated. But they were strong in themselves. Religious people can often be very strong in self will. When defeat came they turned to bitterness and annoyance at others who would dare to be as they had dreamed once.

Sometimes such people imagine that others do not understand. Some of these may be people who were never regenerated. But it could also include people who were once born again and have been so pounded down by accusation in their conscience they have been deadened to a huge degree.

The blood of Jesus shuts the mouth of the accuser. But there is something else which is needed to shut the devil's mouth. That is the Body, the building, the oneness. This oneness can be touched with just two or three together in a small group.

Originally posted by sonship
The blood of Jesus shuts the mouth of the accuser.

Give me an example of this from this community.