17 Mar 05
...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by saffa73I am doing my best to establish a Spirituality Forum reference for answering these sorts of questions. Please see my thread "The Heaven or Hell Algorithm." Needless to say, it is a work in progress, but based on the current state of the algorithm, things aren't looking too bad for you. The Catholics, at least, tend to agree that belief in Jesus is not a necessary condition for salvation.
...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?
17 Mar 05
1 edit
Originally posted by saffa73An underlying assumption of the algorithm is that Heaven and Hell perfectly partition all souls in the afterlife. Thus, if you do not go to Hell, you necessarily end up in Heaven.
Also, will I get into Heaven?
While this assumption may not be in accord with all faiths represented here, it is my chosen starting point. After this algorithm is perfected, it could be incorporated into a larger system that relaxes the assumption in question, to be used in conjunction with other similar algorithms based on competing assumptions, all to be managed by a meta-algorithm that decides which of the sub-algorithms shall be invoked.
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesOy Vey! 😵
An underlying assumption of the algorithm is that Heaven and Hell perfectly partition all souls in the afterlife. Thus, if you do not go to Hell, you necessarily end up in Heaven.
While this assumption may not be in accord with all faiths represented here, it is my chosen starting point. After this algorithm is perfected, it could be incorporate ...[text shortened]... all to be managed by a meta-algorithm that decides which of the sub-algorithms shall be invoked.
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by saffa73
...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?
One question for ya.
Why do you believe you are good (which you seem to be) and a murderer/rapist is bad. I.E What caused you to good and what caused the rapist to become bad ?
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by saffa73
...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?
17: And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18: And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19: Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
20: And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
21: Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
22: And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
Mark, chapter 10
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by pcaspianKindness towards your fellow man/woman?
Originally posted by saffa73
[b]...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?
One que ...[text shortened]... a murderer/rapist is bad. I.E What caused you to good and what caused the rapist to become bad ?[/b]
P
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeYou've posted this for a reason, Ivanhoe. Do you care to give an
17: And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18: And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19: Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do no ...[text shortened]... at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
Mark, chapter 10
exegesis?
Are you suggesting that all people must give up all their possessions,
take up 'their cross' and follow Jesus to be saved (on top of keeping
the commandments)?
Nemesio
18 Mar 05
1 edit
Originally posted by ivanhoeI also have a question for you based on nothing more than curiosity. When you study the Bible, do you read an English or Dutch version? I can imagine that you would find Dutch to be more practical as it is your native language, but I could also envision English being more practical as I presume there is a larger body of Catholic scriptural analysis availible in English, using English terms explained and elaborated upon in English.
17: And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18: And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none g ...[text shortened]... grieved: for he had great possessions.
Mark, chapter 10
The reason I thought to ask was because it struck me as odd that you're quoting from a less-than-modern version that uses language such as "thou" and "callest" and "hast." I'd expect a non-native English speaker to use the most modern English translation available in the interest of easy comprehension, unless one has always studied the Bible in more traditional English language.
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesJohn 14:6 Jesus saith to him, `I am the way, and the truth, and the life, no one doth come unto the Father, if not through me;
I am doing my best to establish a Spirituality Forum reference for answering these sorts of questions. Please see my thread "The Heaven or Hell Algorithm." Needless to say, it is a work in progress, but based on the current state of the algorithm, things aren't looking too bad for you. The Catholics, at least, tend to agree that belief in Jesus is not a necessary condition for salvation.
If a Catholic does not believe in Jesus, then they will not see the Father. That does not mean the "Holy Father" the Pope, but rather the Lord. In fact the reference to the Pope as "Holy Father" is blasphemous as far as I am concerned.
The term "Holy Father" is only found in one place, "John 17:11 and no more am I in the world, and these are in the world, and I come unto Thee. Holy Father, keep them in Thy name, whom Thou hast given to me, that they may be one as we;". This was when Jesus was praying for all believers and address His God and Father.
The regligious traditions of the Catholic Church have many practices which are not biblical and sometimes completely contrary to principals of the Gospel. However, not believing Jesus is the only way to the Father's presence is a new one on me. Though I would not doubt it considering the things I have read of their belief system. Perhaps a someone of the Catholic Faith will answer here.
Una
18 Mar 05
1 edit
Originally posted by NemesioI posted the story of the Rich Young Ruler as a comment on the first post in this thread. Maybe this poster, Saffa73, has anything to say about The Rich Young Ruler in connection to this post ? I would love to hear his comment.
You've posted this for a reason, Ivanhoe. Do you care to give an
exegesis?
Are you suggesting that all people must give up all their possessions,
take up 'their cross' and follow Jesus to be saved (on top of keeping
the commandments)?
Nemesio
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesDoctorS: "When you study the Bible, do you read an English or Dutch version?
I also have a question for you based on nothing more than curiosity. When you study the Bible, do you read an English or Dutch version? I can imagine that you would find Dutch to be more practical as it is your native language, but I could also envision English being more practical as I presume there is a larger body of Catholic scriptural analysis ...[text shortened]... asy comprehension, unless one has always studied the Bible in more traditional English language.
I use Dutch versions and English versions.
English versions:
http://bible.gospelcom.net/versions/index.php?action=getVersionInfo&vid=15&lang=2
http://etext.virginia.edu/kjv.browse.html
and if you want them "all" there is:
http://www.biblegateway.com/
18 Mar 05
Originally posted by saffa73No
...I lead a good life.
I don't steal, kill, rape, swear, commit adultery etc.
I am kind, caring, sensitive and donate to charities.
When I die, I belive I will be buried and my body will rot away and that is the end.
But if there is a God, will I go to Hell because I didn't believe in him?