Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Oh yes they can.

you must be either a lawyer or a sane person. you may be capable of being mistaken here and there, but at least you appear rational.

what a contrast.

Originally posted by twhitehead
I was not responding to your refusal to swallow propaganda, I was responding to your rudeness in telling someone to go to another country that has nothing to do with him other than possibly a shared religion and some heritage such as culture and race.
I am not sure what country you come from but I will assume you are of European descent. If you were disc ...[text shortened]... an nation because thats where all you whities come from, would I be displaying Christian values?

There are such things as Christian values? I mean, other than real estate values?

one learns something new every day!

Originally posted by twhitehead
I am Zambian. My skin is white and my parents were born in the UK, but they have lived in Zambia for as long as Zambia has existed and I was born there. We are as Zambian as any other Zambian. All of us require visas to travel to the UK. The labels you have used are used more as cultural or racial terms rather than national or continental identities. I wo ...[text shortened]... ights in Europe nor can anyone in Africa claim to have more right to be in Africa than I do.

you begin to get it. now explain why you are as Zambian, as African as any other Zambian, any other African.

Originally posted by twhitehead
But are you willing to go back a few more generations and trace where they came from? How long back? Where do you draw the line?
Several of the tribes of Zambia arrived in Zambia because they were chased out of South Africa by Shaka. This happened after Europeans had colonized the cape. So the white skinned decedents of those early settlers are more Sout ...[text shortened]... than the decedents of the tribes I mentioned are Zambian. But how many generations does it take?

descendants, not decedents, pls.

Originally posted by twhitehead
I am Zambian. My skin is white and my parents were born in the UK, but they have lived in Zambia for as long as Zambia has existed and I was born there. We are as Zambian as any other Zambian. All of us require visas to travel to the UK. The labels you have used are used more as cultural or racial terms rather than national or continental identities. I wo ...[text shortened]... ights in Europe nor can anyone in Africa claim to have more right to be in Africa than I do.

But you are not African in that you are not from Africa nationally, socially, or ethnically.

Originally posted by twhitehead
But are you willing to go back a few more generations and trace where they came from? How long back? Where do you draw the line?
Several of the tribes of Zambia arrived in Zambia because they were chased out of South Africa by Shaka. This happened after Europeans had colonized the cape. So the white skinned decedents of those early settlers are more Sout ...[text shortened]... than the decedents of the tribes I mentioned are Zambian. But how many generations does it take?

This sort of thing happened naturally, though, not as a result of imperialism or the whims of richer nations.

Originally posted by Scriabin
A racist mental case as well -- keep talking, you should know, to be fair, that the usual rule for sane people is once they find themselves in a hole they should first stop digging.

Not you, though, my goodness, no, not you.

Whites in Africa are not African as blacks in Africa are. It's no more racist than any other fact of identity. Whites moved there because of imperial actions against the African people. That's how apartheid was developed.

Originally posted by Scriabin
you begin to get it. now explain why you are as Zambian, as African as any other Zambian, any other African.

He is not ethnically African. His identity exists in a dreamworld that refuses to recognize anything other than the imperial mindset. As does your philosophy, because Jordan did not exist as any sort of country or region until Britain and France took over the former Ottoman Empire.

Originally posted by scherzo
Whites in Africa are not African as blacks in Africa are. It's no more racist than any other fact of identity. Whites moved there because of imperial actions against the African people. That's how apartheid was developed.

why, thank you for that stunning performance. You are even worse than a racist, you are a racialist.

A Jordanian racialist nutcase who denies his own country, the land of his birth ...

If you are at all representative of a larger collection of Arabs, it becomes more clear why there are so many unfortunate negative Turkish sayings about you.

Originally posted by scherzo
He is not ethnically African. His identity exists in a dreamworld that refuses to recognize anything other than the imperial mindset. As does your philosophy, because Jordan did not exist as any sort of country or region until Britain and France took over the former Ottoman Empire.

I suggest you consult the King of Jordan on that point - I'm sure he'd be glad, personally, to sit down with you and hear you out.

Originally posted by scherzo
Whites in Africa are not African as blacks in Africa are. It's no more racist than any other fact of identity. Whites moved there because of imperial actions against the African people. That's how apartheid was developed.

so being black or white is a social or ethnic distinction?

see, this is what I mean by paranoid schizophrenia -- a complete detachment and denial of the reality sane people live within.

you, poor sod that you are, have invented an entire world that exists only between your own ears -- such a small small world, too.

how sad ... you really should be wearing clownface and standing on a soapbox in Hyde Park with all the folks of all shapes and colors gathered around, laughing, splitting their sides at the nonsense you say

Originally posted by twhitehead
I was not responding to your refusal to swallow propaganda, I was responding to your rudeness in telling someone to go to another country that has nothing to do with him other than possibly a shared religion and some heritage such as culture and race.
I am not sure what country you come from but I will assume you are of European descent. If you were disc ...[text shortened]... an nation because thats where all you whities come from, would I be displaying Christian values?

I was not responding to your refusal to swallow propaganda, I was responding to your rudeness in telling someone to go to another country that has nothing to do with him other than possibly a shared religion and some heritage such as culture and race.

Where to start.

First, there is no such thing as race. Man is the race. We have made distinctions with respect to ethnic identification, but there is but one race.

Second, Israel consists of an overwhelming amount of Jews--- over 75%--- and barely one-fifth Arabs. In the earliest part of the present conflict, that majority was content to accept both the concept and boundaries of a two-state region, as numerated by the United Nations. The Arabs rejected such a notion and civil war has ensued nearly unabated for 63 years since.

The Arabs (not all, just those causing all of the turmoil) have a stated policy to drive the Jew into oblivion. Hardly concillatory, by any standard.

Third, a shared religion, heritage and culture are (in your thinking) somehow poor motivation to warrant a move? Maybe human nature has changed, but typically, people tend to group almost entirely along such lines. And, to top it off, the trouble-makering Arabs in Israel have yet another thing in common with more than a few members of the Arab states: an intense hatred for the Jew. If the usual ties that bind people together aren't enough, one would think that their common hatred would tip the scale.

And yet it (the hatred) doesn't make them move. It's almost as though they would rather stay and fight than move an live in peace. Wonder why.

I am not sure what country you come from but I will assume you are of European descent.
USA. Nearly 400 years ago, my direct lineage came over from Holland.

If you were discussing a conflict in your country and I told you to just shut up and get lost to some east European nation because thats where all you whities come from, would I be displaying Christian values?
No, you'd be displaying an appalling sense of history and/or human dynamics. Christian values have nothing to do with the topic, really.

The fact of the matter is, "my country" has been in constant conflict since long before "whities" started colonizing nearly 400 years ago--- back when the first "whities" came across the Bering Straight and began migrating into the rest of North America.

Part of the benefits of E Pluribus Unum is dealing with conflicts in a manner which will benefit the greatest number of people. Have we perfected it? No, but at least we are facing the challenge with a little more openness and honesty than some. Obstacles and shortfalls abound, but at least we don't have open civil war here despite having the most diverse groups of people on the planet.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Christian values have nothing to do with the topic, really.

I know. I was merely surprised that someone claiming to be Christian would be so rude and unempathetic.

Part of the benefits of E Pluribus Unum is dealing with conflicts in a manner which will benefit the greatest number of people. Have we perfected it? No, but at least we are facing the challenge with a little more openness and honesty than some. Obstacles and shortfalls abound, but at least we don't have open civil war here despite having the most diverse groups of people on the planet.
So why do you think that the best solution for other countries is for the people you view as the trouble makers to get out and go to some other country? And worse why do you wish to push them onto someone else, why not invite them to join you in the USA?

Originally posted by Scriabin
why, thank you for that stunning performance. You are even worse than a racist, you are a racialist.

A Jordanian racialist nutcase who denies his own country, the land of his birth ...

If you are at all representative of a larger collection of Arabs, it becomes more clear why there are so many unfortunate negative Turkish sayings about you.

Listen, thickhead:

Just because I was born somewhere doesn't mean I'm from there!

How many times must I pound it into your puny filibustering brain?!?

Originally posted by Scriabin
I suggest you consult the King of Jordan on that point - I'm sure he'd be glad, personally, to sit down with you and hear you out.

I'm more willing to shoot the king down than have a discussion with him. Frankly, though, that's not saying much, as I've been fairly outspoken on ending the regime of the Hashemite dynasty.