Originally posted by karoly aczelOkay, we got this one group who thinks beheading those that get in the way
Commom sense should prevail. When it does not, a simple vote should give a pretty good indication on what that society thinks (roughly) what the common good is.
Communication in short.
of their drug deals is okay, because for them their good is being hindered by
those that want to stop drug deals, then we have those that do not want to
get beheaded, but want to drug deals to stop. At what point in time do you
think those two groups will put up their thoughts about what is good to a vote?
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayWhat do you think it means, common good? A splinter extremist violent gang? That is not common good, that is thugism. Common good entails taking into consideration the whole community. It is definitely not common good for gangs like that to murder tens of thousands of people so the US can support its drug habit and supply the Mexican cartels with weapons.
Okay, we got this one group who thinks beheading those that get in the way
of their drug deals is okay, because for them their good is being hindered by
those that want to stop drug deals, then we have those that do not want to
get beheaded, but want to drug deals to stop. At what point in time do you
think those two groups will put up their thoughts about what is good to a vote?
Kelly
Common good requires empathy and intelligence. For instance, if the common good was thought about during the prohibition years, there would have been no prohibition, because the whole thing was brought about by religious right wing nut jobs getting into political power.
Then Hoover and Anslinger, being extreme racists, went after Mexicans and blacks, Jazz and blues players, who used pot, as a weapon against them. You can see how well that went. Common good in that case would be to have left sleeping dogs lie and not criminalize soft drugs or hard drugs for that matter.
There would have been no money for the cartels to be making, no reason for them to kill by the thousands as they are now. As your bible says, we reap what we sow and we sowed a big one with prohibition which grew the mafia a hundred times more powerful and rich.
The Hoover/Anslinger criminalization of drugs made drugs now hard to get, jail terms and such, so got teenagers interested in prohibited stuff that would never have happened had it been freely available like it was all along. Until drugs were made illegal, nobody even paid much attention, outside a small clique in the country. So we now see how well THAT turned out.
That would have been an example of common good.
Originally posted by sonhouseWell the common good is going to be defined by someone, who gets to say
What do you think it means, common good? A splinter extremist violent gang? That is not common good, that is thugism. Common good entails taking into consideration the whole community. It is definitely not common good for gangs like that to murder tens of thousands of people so the US can support its drug habit and supply the Mexican cartels with weapons. ...[text shortened]... try. So we now see how well THAT turned out.
That would have been an example of common good.
who is extremist? You really do keep coming up with terms that need to be
defined by someone. I just keep wondering, who gets to define who is what
again? Why would all the drug users of the world be less than someone who
isn't a drug user in your opinion? Why would one group's desire be less than
another if everyone has desires? You have a shifting standard in my opinion,
it seems to be okay for some not others. If there isn't a standard for all that
all are held to, than why is somone's desire bad and anothers thought of as
good? Who are you to say?
Kelly
Originally posted by sonhouseReligious groups are just people, and if God isn't real that is all everyone is
So religious groups don't argue. I did not know that.
nothing more. God changes it all, because what standards He sets are set for
all it does not matter what people think one way or another.
Kelly
Originally posted by sonhouseWhy not? It would be almost as easy as getting rid of religion.
Of course not. There is no way to homogenize the world.
To make war without religion you have to be saying I want your resources, your land, your women, something like that
Not at all. Jealousy often comes into it, yes, but it is also about not understanding the other party. I have seen conflict between races and nationalities. A lot of people simply have a distrust or dislike for people who are different.
So tell me, what resources, land or women are India and Pakistan arguing over? What about North and South Korea? Or are those religious conflicts?
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Originally posted by twhiteheadIf you look at the North Korean economy you see it in shambles, 90% of the budget going to the military.
Why not? It would be almost as easy as getting rid of religion.
[b]To make war without religion you have to be saying I want your resources, your land, your women, something like that
Not at all. Jealousy often comes into it, yes, but it is also about not understanding the other party. I have seen conflict between races and nationalities. A lot o ...[text shortened]... a and Pakistan arguing over? What about North and South Korea? Or are those religious conflicts?[/b]
They have to be looking at the south enviously with their resources.
Right now North Sudan is building up armies presumably to attack the new state of South Sudan, don't think that is religious.
All I am saying it is extremely wrong to start wars based on religion and remove that and the fighting will be reduced, not eliminated.
Despots like Gadhafi will always be around in parts of the world where they can ply their death wares in secrecy or near secrecy. That has to stop also and the rebels there are trying to do that. There is no common good for Gadhafi to be killing his own people.
Here is a link to the Nuba people, who had Jihad declared on them in 92:
Definitely religious based warfare:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-13351773
Originally posted by sonhouse"whatever they call their religious leader" is the operative phrase. I don't know how the Catholic system works, but in my good ol' Protestant church, I don't go to my "religious leader" for advice or when I'm confused. Advice comes from Dear Abby; confusion: easily cleared up by Google and/or snopes.😀
Those other people are ALREADY in power. Say confession in catholic church, do penance. That isn't power? Confused people seeking help from their priest, or whatever they call the religious leader in their flock, the person giving the advice based on religion, that is not power? That is not feedback holding on to the person seeking advice?
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Originally posted by twhiteheadNeither of those two are about religion. For the Pakistan/India war read here: http://www.mtholyoke.edu/~nmonasch/pakistan-india%20conflict.html
Why not? It would be almost as easy as getting rid of religion.
[b]To make war without religion you have to be saying I want your resources, your land, your women, something like that
Not at all. Jealousy often comes into it, yes, but it is also about not understanding the other party. I have seen conflict between races and nationalities. A lot o ...[text shortened]... a and Pakistan arguing over? What about North and South Korea? Or are those religious conflicts?[/b]
North and South Korea are divided by economic ideologies, and the fact that atheist Kim Jong Il is a wacko.
Doward 4 Twit 0...I've decided to keep score at how many times I prove how ignorant you are, so far I am waaay ahead
Originally posted by KellyJaySo religious groups are just people. So are atheist groups. Religious groups are extremely arrogant in my view, thinking only they have the correct take on god.
Religious groups are just people, and if God isn't real that is all everyone is
nothing more. God changes it all, because what standards He sets are set for
all it does not matter what people think one way or another.
Kelly
You and all your ilk are sadly deluded, listening to hallucinating people who think they are in touch with some god or other. Not a bit different than taking the word of the village shaman. EXACTLY the same.
Originally posted by sonhouseI think people in general are extremely arrogant, so you will not get an
So religious groups are just people. So are atheist groups. Religious groups are extremely arrogant in my view, thinking only they have the correct take on god.
You and all your ilk are sadly deluded, listening to hallucinating people who think they are in touch with some god or other. Not a bit different than taking the word of the village shaman. EXACTLY the same.
argument from me there. I also believe everyone believes their own views on
universe are the correct ones or at least the one that everyone else should
have more times than not. So are far as I'm concern nothing you've said
about the 'religious' isn't also true of Atheist as well.
The great question is, is God real can get a little fuzzy by actions of some
who profess a belief in Him. There is no doubt about that.
Kelly
Originally posted by karoly aczelWell, sonhouse is an atheist and he only has this time on earth to be able
I am always amazed how you guys can talk past each other so often and conveniantly ignore the questions I want answered most, (whether they are asked by me or someone else), let alone ignoring the germane points of most posts directed at you.
There is not much reason or logic in your posts and I'm surprised more people haven't ignored you. (I wont igno ...[text shortened]... here if you wish, but if we are not on the same page then there is no progress to be made)
to change his mind and escape eternal torment by turning to Jesus the
Christ for salvation. There is no other way but through Jesus for He is
the door to an eternal life of joy according to the scriptures. I am sounding
the warning while he still has time.
Originally posted by RJHindsOkay, now I believe you're actually just a satirist. Good show. 😉
Well, sonhouse is an atheist and he only has this time on earth to be able
to change his mind and escape eternal torment by turning to Jesus the
Christ for salvation. There is no other way but through Jesus for He is
the door to an eternal life of joy according to the scriptures. I am sounding
the warning while he still has time.