Spirituality
13 Mar 19
13 Mar 19
Genesis 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
I've asked this before.
Some believe in a steady state universe.
Some believe the universe created itself out of nothing.
Some believe in this that or the other things.
With cause (defend your belief) can anyone come up with a reason for everything?
@kellyjay saidSome believe the universe created itself out of nothing.
Genesis 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
I've asked this before.
Some believe in a steady state universe.
Some believe the universe created itself out of nothing.
Some believe in this that or the other things.
With cause (defend your belief) can anyone come up with a reason for everything?
I know of no one who believes this. IIRC you've repeatedly made this claim in the past and have been repeatedly corrected. If that's the case, how do you justify your dishonesty to yourself?
@kellyjay saidWhat do you mean by "a reason"?
With cause (defend your belief) can anyone come up with a reason for everything?
It seems to me, by using that word, you seek to restrict the discussion to the reiteration of religious-type theories about the "intent" of some kind of supernatural being.
If so, then who is it you want to have that discussion with here? Fellow creationists?
You should define what you mean by "a reason" in this context.
@kellyjay saidUsing galactic counts the Hubble sphere has been estimated to have a mass-energy in the range of 1.5 x 10^53 kg, which is a lot of stuff, but apparently not much when compared to the size of the universe, in fact nearer a perfect vacuum than anything artificially created on earth. (Ref Quora)
Genesis 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
I've asked this before.
Some believe in a steady state universe.
Some believe the universe created itself out of nothing.
Some believe in this that or the other things.
With cause (defend your belief) can anyone come up with a reason for everything?
But still if we consider E = mc^2 (energy = mass x speed of light squared) like all equations is reversible to (speed of light squared x mass = energy) then I suppose all that mass (1.5 x 10^53 kg), must have been produced by an awful lot of energy.
Assuming my layperson’s physics principles are correct we could propose that God shot a bolt of mega-lightening into the void which resulted in it being explosively converted into mass and stretched out across an ever increasing space time continuum.
Or it could be like a perpetual expansion and collapse, like this:
https://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/mt/2018/02/BigBounce_2880x1220/lead_960.gif?1517608670
So we can look at it and say “well creation is simply a matter of being able to control sufficient energy to convert it into mass” or one could say “we just don’t know”.
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29602
13 Mar 19
@kellyjay saidPlease specify one person here who believes the universe created itself out of nothing.
Genesis 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
I've asked this before.
Some believe in a steady state universe.
Some believe the universe created itself out of nothing.
Some believe in this that or the other things.
With cause (defend your belief) can anyone come up with a reason for everything?
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
13 Mar 19
3 edits
There are two major In the beginning[s] in the word of God.
Genesis 1:1
&
John 1:1
But they are not the same.
Genesis 1:1 is the beginning of the creation of the heavens and the earth, ie the universe.
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." (Gen 1:1)
The "beginning" in John 1:1 is different. That is the, lets say, the beginning WITHOUT a beginning. That is eternity.
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. " (John 1:1)
That is a human language limitation. It expresses eternity. It expresses without beginning - ever existing.
Remember the there is in the Bible the beginning of the universe. And there is an eternal life without beginning - God, even the Triune God.
13 Mar 19
@kellyjay saidWhat are you trying to achieve. Do you think your question has some sort of nuanced incision into the already threadbare debate on this topic of how did the universe come into existence?
No takers, no one has a reason for why they believe what they do, and don't even want to admit what they think?
Theists, especially Christians believe God created everything, atheists don’t.
13 Mar 19
@fmf saidStop confusing KellyJay with metaphors.
To use a metaphor, half way down page 1, this comes across as a premature ejaculation.
@divegeester saidThe "reason" why "God" created the universe appears to be, according to many Christians, to set up a kind of laboratory for inherently evil and wicked creatures he has created, a laboratory which "He" uses to figure out which ones "He" is going to torture for not believing "He" had set up the laboratory.
What are you trying to achieve. Do you think your question has some sort of nuanced incision into the already threadbare debate on this topic of how did the universe come into existence?
Theists, especially Christians believe God created everything, atheists don’t.
13 Mar 19
@fmf saidThat interpretation goes strongly against my moral compass.
The "reason" why "God" created the universe, according to many Christians, appears to be to set up a kind of laboratory for inherently evil and wicked creatures which "He" uses to figure out which ones "He" is going to torture for not believing "He" had set up the laboratory.
Darn it, more metaphors...