Jesus Said 'Beware of False Prophets'

Originally posted by @divegeester
What do you think of, and what is the Watchtower perspective on Romans 10:09?

9 For if you publicly declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and exercise faith in your heart that God raised him up from the dead, "you will be saved".

Notice the exact wording.... It does not say "you are saved" but you "will be saved". And again all the rest of the bible says being saved is conditional if you would go back and see my post and try to understand.
Jesus nor the apostles ever once told anybody they themselves were saved, did they? If so please show me those scriptures if the really exist......

Originally posted by @galveston75
Jesus nor the apostles ever once told anybody they themselves were saved, did they? If so please show me those scriptures if the really exist......

Yes I’ve also noted the exact wording in prior readings over the years.
In regards to telling people they are saved:

Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."
Luke 23:43 (and the other mentions of the same statement. )

Furthermore if you read past Romans 10 verse 9 to include verse 10 it follows on as:

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Yes I’ve also noted the exact wording in prior readings over the years.
In regards to telling people they are saved:

Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."
Luke 23:43 (and the other mentions of the same statement. )

Furthermore if you read past Romans 10 verse 9 to include verse 10 it follows on as:

Be ...[text shortened]... eart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and [b]is saved.[/b]

'He HAS saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time.'

2 Timothy 1:9

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
'He HAS saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time.'

2 Timothy 1:9

Good passage. Its the point I have made several times here which Chrsitians dont like :
Saved does not necessarily mean eternal life in the Kingdom of God.

Paul made this very clear in several of his writings to the churches. The process is like this:
- a man hears about God/Christ
- he is taught the word of God and the teachings of Christ
- he accepts Christ and is baptised into Christ
- he is a new creature in Christ [SAVED]
- God grants him the gift of the Holy Spirit which guides the mans future life
- after this one of two things can happen
- he lives a good righteous life [ETERNAL LIFE]
- he lives a life of sin and evil and is cast out

Saved and eternal life and two different things.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Yes I’ve also noted the exact wording in prior readings over the years.
In regards to telling people they are saved:

Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."
Luke 23:43 (and the other mentions of the same statement. )

Furthermore if you read past Romans 10 verse 9 to include verse 10 it follows on as:

Be ...[text shortened]... eart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and [b]is saved.[/b]

In that case of the thief on the cross,saved and eternal life happened at around the same time because the man died shortly after. The decision about eternal life is subject to the life lived by the man and is made after death and judgment. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: (Hebrews 9:27 KJV)

Perhaps other bibles may have a clearer view of salvation and maybe not influenced by the being saved now idea.

Romans 10:10 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

10 "For with the heart one goes on trusting and thus continues toward righteousness, while with the mouth one keeps on making public acknowledgement and thus continues toward deliverance."


Romans 10:10 Expanded Bible (EXB)

10 [L For] We believe with our hearts, and so we ·are made right with God [are justified; receive righteousness]. And we ·declare [confess] with our mouths, ·and so we are saved [leading to salvation].

If all it took to be saved was the act of confessing in their belief of Jesus as their savior, why did the apostle Paul doubt up to his death of his status with his salvation? Did he not confess his faith in Jesus?

If all it took was to confess your faith in Jesus and you are now saved, what are you saved from?

Do you still sin? Is a sinful person worthy of the status of immortality that Jesus was given by his Father, seeing that Jesus never sinned?

Phil 2:12:
"Consequently, my beloved ones, just as you have always obeyed, not only during my presence but now much more readily during my absence, keep working out your own salvation with fear and trembling".

What does this scripture mean? If being saved is sooooo easy, why this warning?

Originally posted by @rajk999
In that case of the thief on the cross,saved and eternal life happened at around the same time because the man died shortly after. The decision about eternal life is subject to the life lived by the man and is made after death and judgment. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: (Hebrews 9:27 KJV)

You asked for an example of where Jesus or the apostles said someone was saved and I gave you two.

You could at least acknowledge this...

Originally posted by @galveston75

Do you think you have a good case?
You don't.

Salvation or being saved involves the three parts of our being - spirit and soul and body. So clearly we can see STAGES of the full outworking of being saved.

"And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly, and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (1 Thess. 5:23)

So the New Testament speaks to SAVED sometimes in stages as a process.

The human spirit is saved in regeneration.
The human soul is saved in transformation.
The human body is saved in transfiguration.

So I have been saved.
Yet I am also BEING saved.
And eventually I WILL BE saved.

So any appeal to words such as "unto salvation" as if salvation is a future event, are perfectly understandable.

Now did Jesus in the red letters (so to speak) ever say His disciples WERE ... SAVED?

Logic would have it that to be SAVED as in not under condemnation was to the disciples while they believed in the Son of God.

"He who believes into Him is not condemened, but He who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed into the name of the only begotten Son of God." (John 3:18)

NOT condemned must be SAVED from condemnation and VERSES "condemned already". This would amount to Jesus telling His disciples, even before His death and resurrection, that they are saved from eternal condemnation.

And as someone pointed out, the believing thief on the cross had the assurance that he was saved and would be in Paradise WITH Jesus on that very day.

WHERE that is is not the point.
That it is with Jesus there too must mean salvation because of his belief in Jesus so as to be with Him.

"And he said, Jesus, remember me when You come into Your kingdom.

And He said to him, Truly I say to you, Today you shall be with Me in Paradise." (Luke 23:42,43)

He was not saved from the torture of his soul and body on that cross. But as to eternal separation from God, he had the assurance that from that he was saved. He would be with Jesus in Paradise.

Don't distract by arguing over whether Paradise is Heaven or somewhere else. It doesn't matter.

I would submit this also as an affirmative:

"You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you." (John 15:3)

I would take that to mean that even before He goes to the cross, in virtue of them believing Him and His word, they are ALREADY Justified, made clean before God by their receiving His word.

The key word is "ALREADY". They were virtually already SAVED.

Of course His Apostle - Paul, said that the believers HAVE BEEN [past tense] SAVED.

"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God." (Eph. 2:8)

Originally posted by @sonship
Do you think you have a good case?
You don't.

Salvation or being saved involves the three parts of our being - spirit and soul and body. So clearly we can see STAGES of the full outworking of being saved.

[b] "And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly, and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame, at the ...[text shortened]... aved through faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God." (Eph. 2:8)

[/b]

"And the God of peace Himself sanctify you wholly, and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (1 Thess. 5:23)

Ok lets look at this first? Has Jesus come as you believe he will? If so, as you believe, where is he? If he has come as you believe, then you are now saved, right?

Originally posted by @divegeester
You (Galveston75) asked for an example of where Jesus or the apostles said someone was saved and I gave you two.

You could at least acknowledge this...

I guess he’s not going to.
Nothing changes.

Matthew 24:13 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

13 but he who did endure to the end, he shall be saved;
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

Please explain?????

Originally posted by @divegeester
I guess he’s not going to.
Nothing changes.

I did right above your post.

Originally posted by @galveston75
I did right above your post.

That’s a reply to sonship 😕

Originally posted by @galveston75
I did right above your post.

Do you mean the random post not replying to anyone where you just posts some alternative translations which suit you?

Originally posted by @divegeester
You asked for an example of where Jesus or the apostles said someone was saved and I gave you two.

You could at least acknowledge this...

Galveston asked that not me .