1. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 21:121 edit
    The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing.

    Isaac Asimov

    It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; to search out a matter is the glory of kings.

    Proverbs 25:2

    I'd like to say "discuss"; but there is something slightly pompous about posting that in a debate forum. But I do invite discussion and opinion of this premise and these quotations.

    Whilst we are all opinionated, and let's be honest now, we all are (even you scientists fight like cat and dog when there is a discovery, a prize or some peer recognition at stake), there are some here who truly believe they have THE truth. Where is the joy of discovery for them?

    Look and see how Asimov and David both perceived the same truth separated by millennia in terms of time and a chasm in terms of philosophy.

    Err...discuss.
  2. Joined
    18 Jan '07
    Moves
    6792
    10 Jan '15 21:32
    Originally posted by divegeester
    Whilst we are all opinionated, and let's be honest now, we all are (even you scientists fight like cat and dog when there is a discovery, a prize or some peer recognition at stake), there are some here who truly believe they have THE truth. Where is the joy of discovery for them?[/b]
    Dunno... it's not very Christian to claim that you're perfect, is it?

    Look and see how Asimov and David both perceived the same truth separated by millennia in terms of time and a chasm in terms of philosophy.

    Not that much of a chasm. Asimov was Jewish, and well versed in the Bible.
  3. Joined
    27 Sep '06
    Moves
    9651
    10 Jan '15 21:46
    Originally posted by divegeester
    [b]The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing.

    Isaac Asimov

    It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; to search out a matter is the glory of kings.

    Proverbs 25:2

    I'd like to say "discuss"; but there is something slightly pompous about posting that in a debate forum. But I do invite discussion and opinion of ...[text shortened]... h separated by millennia in terms of time and a chasm in terms of philosophy.

    Err...discuss.[/b]
    "The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing."

    Like the anticlimax at the end of a journey.

    Not sure about the application you're using with Proverbs 25. Can't really say since I'm not sure what it means, but it might have something to do with 1 Corinthians 2:8

    "Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known [it], they would not have crucified the Lord of glory."

    God had certainly concealed from Satan the effect crucifying Jesus would have on him!
  4. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 21:51
    Originally posted by Shallow Blue
    Look and see how Asimov and David both perceived the same truth separated by millennia in terms of time and a chasm in terms of philosophy.

    Not that much of a chasm. Asimov was Jewish, and well versed in the Bible.[/b]
    “I am an atheist, out and out. It took me a long time to say it. I've been an atheist for years and years..."

    Isaac Asimov.
  5. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 21:52
    Originally posted by Shallow Blue
    Dunno... it's not very Christian to claim that you're perfect, is it?
    As much as I take issue with those who claim to know THE truth, I would defend them in that I've never heard then say they are "perfect".
  6. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 21:542 edits
    Originally posted by josephw
    [b]"The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing."

    Like the anticlimax at the end of a journey[/b]
    Why would discovery be an anticlimax in your view? Either physical or metaphysical.
  7. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 21:57
    Originally posted by josephw
    Not sure about the application you're using with Proverbs 25. Can't really say since I'm not sure what it means, but it might have something to do with 1 Corinthians 2:8
    The purpose of this thread is to generate discussion on the various opinions of that scripture. And the other if you feel it relevant...
  8. Joined
    27 Sep '06
    Moves
    9651
    10 Jan '15 21:57
    Originally posted by divegeester
    “I am an atheist, out and out. It took me a long time to say it. I've been an atheist for years and years..."

    Isaac Asimov.
    Do you think that if one believes "there is no God" that that disqualifies them from knowing and understanding anything about God, and that their thoughts and opinions have no bearing on anything related to God and things spiritual?

    In other words, does anything they say they think or believe really matter at all?
  9. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 22:01
    Originally posted by josephw
    Do you think that if one believes "there is no God" that that disqualifies them from knowing and understanding anything about God, and that their thoughts and opinions have no bearing on anything related to God and things spiritual?

    In other words, does anything they say they think or believe really matter at all?
    No, is the short answer, it does not disqualify them, IMO.

    What someone says or believes is demonstrable in their actions. Actions speak louder, right?
  10. Joined
    27 Sep '06
    Moves
    9651
    10 Jan '15 22:05
    Originally posted by divegeester
    Why would discovery be an anticlimax in your view? Either physical or metaphysical.
    I guess that would depend on the discovery and the events of the journey toward that discovery.

    Life is full of surprises and disappointments. Physical and metaphysically. Depends on how much truth one knows I suppose.
  11. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 22:071 edit
    Originally posted by josephw
    I guess that would depend on the discovery and the events of the journey toward that discovery.

    Life is full of surprises and disappointments. Physical and metaphysically. Depends on how much truth one knows I suppose.
    Quite a of lot of "depends". Is there an element of my OP that you feel a conviction about?
  12. Joined
    27 Sep '06
    Moves
    9651
    10 Jan '15 22:14
    Originally posted by divegeester
    No, is the short answer, it does not disqualify them, IMO.

    What someone says or believes is demonstrable in their actions. Actions speak louder, right?
    Action speaks louder.

    I think that when an individual lives out their philosophy of life, and that " living" is at variance with the law of God, that individual, by his actions, has disqualified himself from speaking to the truth.

    And their words count as much as their actions, or can. If one says "there is no God" they automatically disqualify themselves from the truth of God. Seems only logical.
  13. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
    Boston Lad
    USA
    Joined
    14 Jul '07
    Moves
    43012
    10 Jan '15 22:16
    Originally posted by divegeester
    The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing.

    Isaac Asimov

    It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; to search out a matter is the glory of kings.

    Proverbs 25:2

    I'd like to say "discuss"; but there is something slightly pompous about posting that in a debate forum. But I do invite discussion and opinion of th ...[text shortened]... truth separated by millennia in terms of time and a chasm in terms of philosophy.

    Err...discuss.
    Originally posted by divegeester
    The true delight is in the finding out rather than in the knowing.

    Isaac Asimov

    John 8: 31. "So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 32. and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” 33. They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never yet been enslaved to anyone; how is it that You say, ‘You will become free’?”

    34. Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin. 35. “The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever. 36. “So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed. 37. “I know that you are Abraham’s descendants; yet you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38. “I speak the things which I have seen with My Father; therefore you also do the things which you heard from your father.”
    __________________________

    Yes. There's a "true delight" or joy in "discovering" an obscured fact or absolute truth. Then a crossroads decision must be made: Do I believe and accept it or do I disbelieve and reject it as inconvenient to my present frames of reference and/or incompatible with my long held opinions which may be emotionally charged. Knowing trumps discovery in any realm.
  14. Joined
    16 Feb '08
    Moves
    86378
    10 Jan '15 22:17
    Originally posted by josephw
    If one says "there is no God" they automatically disqualify themselves from the truth of God.
    What does being "disqualified from truth of god" mean?
  15. Joined
    27 Sep '06
    Moves
    9651
    10 Jan '15 22:18
    Originally posted by divegeester
    Quite a of lot of "depends". Is there an element of my OP that you feel a conviction about?
    Conviction?

    I am less than perfect in every way. Fortunately the righteousness of Christ was imputed to my "spiritual bank account" when I first trusted in what Jesus did for me at the cross. Perfection comes later.

    This may get deeper than I have time for.
Back to Top