Lets get this straight.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Well, [joke]in your age you have to think of your heart a little[/joke]

Very funny! Actually, I spent the day yesterday cutting firewood. With a chain saw. In the hot sun. Then I ran marathon. After that I had to go to fight a fire in a high rise. I ran up 20 flights of stairs in full gear because the elevator was out. After that I went home and milked 150 cows, bailed hay, and played with my 5 year old son till the sun went down. That boy never stops. Dang near gave me a heart attack chasing him up a 50' tree.
Did all that with a cigarette in my mouth while putting down a case of beer and a pint of whiskey.

Originally posted by josephw
Shows how much you know!

Actually, it shows how much you don't know!

The Bible is true, and science hasn't proved it wrong, and never will.

Really.. so you believe in the flood?

Originally posted by WWindmill
Really.. so you believe in the flood?

Yes W, I believe every word in the Bible.

I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done. As a matter of fact, those that have gone out of their way to do that have ended up converted.

For example; are you familiar with the shroud of Turin? A group of scientist studied the shroud with every kind of scientific method, and they all became believers as a result of their findings. They wrote two books. The Shroud of Turin and The verdict on The Shroud.

You should check it out!

Originally posted by josephw
The Bible is true, and science hasn't proved it wrong, and never will.

Here is one paradox, I just can't understand it...

One christian says "The bible is true in its entirety!" and is very arrogant to the atheists who says otherwise.
Another christian says "Part of, but not all, of the bible is true", evidently contradict the first one. But this christian one is allowed to say this, without any arrogancy.

So how can a bible be entirely true, and at the same time be only partly true? Are these two groups of christians of different religions? Or do one of the groups lying and the other one is not - and which grup is which?

I say that the statement "The bible is true" is dependant that there is no, none at all, errors whatsoever in the bible. If anyone can find one error in the bible, then you cannot trust any part as being truth. Because the only source you have that the bible is true, is the bible itself. Circular evidence...

And, Josephw, don't be mad at me now, only because I quoted you. I just quoted everyone having the same belief as you have.

Originally posted by josephw
Yes W, I believe every word in the Bible.

I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done. As a matter of fact, those that have gone out of their way to do that have ended up converted.

For example; are you familiar with the shroud of Turin? ...[text shortened]... wrote two books. The Shroud of Turin and The verdict on The Shroud.

You should check it out!

My theory that an invisible troll lives in my fridge and drinks my beer has never been proven false either...doesn't make it true.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Here is one paradox, I just can't understand it...

One christian says "The bible is true in its entirety!" and is very arrogant to the atheists who says otherwise.
Another christian says "Part of, but not all, of the bible is true", evidently contradict the first one. But this christian one is allowed to say this, without any arrogancy.

So how can ...[text shortened]... w, only because I quoted you. I just quoted everyone having the same belief as you have.

Don't worry, I'm over it now. 😉

Yes, it is all quite confusing. One Christian says this and another says that.

One needs to sift through all the rhetoric to get to the truth. I've spent quite alot of time thinking about this. Logic dictates that if the Bible is God's word, originally written by men inspired by God, then it only fallows that God would in turn keep His word free of error through time.

But then, you say, why do the different translations word it differently and subsequently change the meanings? And why do 'believers' have different interpretations of any particular verse?

Well, it's just like everything else in the world isn't it? We all just have to find out the truth for ourselves.

This subject is way too complicated to discuss in this forum. I'd have to write a book in here to explain what I know!

The place to start it is with this. The Bible is true, but men don't get it. Or, the Bible is false, and no one ever will.

Originally posted by TheSkipper
My theory that an invisible troll lives in my fridge and drinks my beer has never been proven false either...doesn't make it true.

Can something true be proven false? Or can something false be proven true?

The answer is no.

Originally posted by josephw
Can something true be proven false? Or can something false be proven true?

The answer is no.

uhm...yeah...that is my point.

Go back a read the message you wrote that i was replying to where you state that "but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done".

Kinda renders those words meaningless doesn't it?

EDIT: Sorry, I misread your post. I meant to add that something flase often can't be proven flase either. particularly when dealing with pixies, trolls, sprites and anything to do with the supernatural. Can you prove the tooth fairy doesn;t exist? You can't...and it has about as much meaning as the fact that i can't prove God or the Bible false.

Originally posted by josephw
Yes W, I believe every word in the Bible.

I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done. As a matter of fact, those that have gone out of their way to do that have ended up converted.

For example; are you familiar with the shroud of Turin? ...[text shortened]... wrote two books. The Shroud of Turin and The verdict on The Shroud.

You should check it out!

Why is there no evidence of a worldwide flood then?

Originally posted by josephw
Don't worry, I'm over it now. 😉

Yes, it is all quite confusing. One Christian says this and another says that.

One needs to sift through all the rhetoric to get to the truth. I've spent quite alot of time thinking about this. Logic dictates that if the Bible is God's word, originally written by men inspired by God, then it only fallows that God would ...[text shortened]... The Bible is true, but men don't get it. Or, the Bible is false, and no one ever will.

So I take you're apologizing of your earlier outburst? Well, your apologized. I have a short memory of intermittent behaviours. Enough of this, let's go further...

But those who doesn't believe that all bible is true, can they really be true cristians? Or is it possible to interprete the letters, the words, the verses, the chapters, the books the testaments, or the bible in whole differently, and still be good christians?

Who is true christians, who decides? Everyone of us, or just some individual who thinks he has the right interpretation at hand, because of his closeness to god, his divine insights, or just his high beliefs of himself?

Originally posted by josephw
Yes W, I believe every word in the Bible.

I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done. As a matter of fact, those that have gone out of their way to do that have ended up converted.

For example; are you familiar with the shroud of Turin? ...[text shortened]... wrote two books. The Shroud of Turin and The verdict on The Shroud.

You should check it out!

…I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done….

-and they don’t need to prove what the Bible teaches is false to justify their claim that it is false!
If those people were truly “smart” then they would have realised that.

The burden of proof is not on the person that refutes a set of hypothesis (such as the set of hypothesis the Bible claims to be true), the burden of proof is on the person that supports a set hypothesis. It is you that is claiming that set of hypothesis is correct so it is you that has to provide evidence to rationally justify your claim that that set of hypothesis is correct. All we (atheists) have to do to justify our claim that the probability of that set of hypothesis being true is vanishing small is to point out that, according to known science, there is no evidence to support that set of hypothesis -that is all!

If that wasn’t the case then how would you argue against somebody that claims Santa exists and quite correctly asserts “nobody has proven that Santa doesn't exist!”?

Originally posted by FabianFnas
So I take you're apologizing of your earlier outburst? Well, your apologized. I have a short memory of intermittent behaviours. Enough of this, let's go further...

But those who doesn't believe that all bible is true, can they really be true cristians? Or is it possible to interprete the letters, the words, the verses, the chapters, the books the testa ...[text shortened]... d, because of his closeness to god, his divine insights, or just his high beliefs of himself?

Some interesting questions here.
Im curious to see what his answers will be.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
So I take you're apologizing of your earlier outburst? Well, your apologized. I have a short memory of intermittent behaviours. Enough of this, let's go further...

But those who doesn't believe that all bible is true, can they really be true cristians? Or is it possible to interprete the letters, the words, the verses, the chapters, the books the testa ...[text shortened]... d, because of his closeness to god, his divine insights, or just his high beliefs of himself?

Regarding "Who is true christians", here are more interesting questions:

Jesus asks one to follow the will of the Father, i.e. live a life of truth, love, justice, compassion, etc.

If one follows the will of the Father, is he not also following what Jesus asks of him? Whether he professes to follow Jesus or not? So, is he not a follower of Jesus?

If one doesn't follow the will of the Father, is he following what Jesus asks of him? Whether he professes to follow Jesus or not? So, is he a follower of Jesus?

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Regarding "Who is true christians", here are more interesting questions:

Jesus asks one to follow the will of the Father, i.e. live a life of truth, love, justice, compassion, etc.

If one follows the will of the Father, is he not also following what Jesus asks of him? Whether he professes to follow Jesus or not? So, is he not a follower of Jesus?
esus asks of him? Whether he professes to follow Jesus or not? So, is he a follower of Jesus?

So you live in a fantasy world of love. That is all good and well but what happens when people like you are placed in a position of power and over 2000 people died while you failed to stop it. i.e. Bush. What are you and your fantasy world of love then going to do?

Originally posted by josephw
Yes W, I believe every word in the Bible.

I know that this will be hard for you to accept, but people smarter than us have tried to prove that what the Bible teaches is false, but it has never been done. As a matter of fact, those that have gone out of their way to do that have ended up converted.

For example; are you familiar with the shroud of Turin? ...[text shortened]... wrote two books. The Shroud of Turin and The verdict on The Shroud.

You should check it out!

Where did the water go?