01 Feb 22
Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.
Are Christians obliged to believe and to assert that this really happened?
@sonship saidAnd yours:
@FMF
Why not?
Which best describes your belief?
A. A Deist ?
B. A Agnostic Deist ?
C. A Agnostic Atheist ?
D. A Atheist Deist ?
E. A Agnostic Atheist Deist ?
D. And X Christian Agnostic Atheist Deist ?
A. Member of a cult
B. Member of a deification cult
C. A snake oil salesman
D. Lost and confused
Edit: Before your edit, you followed E with another D.
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01 Feb 22
@fmf saidNot for salvation, no.Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.
Are Christians obliged to believe and to assert that this really happened?
Neither are they required to believe the creation account in Genesis for salvation.
Salvation is by Grace through faith in Christ Jesus a la John 3:16 and Romans 10:9.
But I think we bring a modern bias to ancient events, assuming news reporters and cameras and printing presses and telephones and all the trappings of modern society were available to people back then who witnessed miraculous events.
Obviously they weren’t.
@fmf saidThe basic requirement for entry into the Kingdom of God is this, and this alone ... Doing the good works Jesus described summarised as charitable brotherly love to those around.Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.
Are Christians obliged to believe and to assert that this really happened?
.... Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. (Matthew 25:34-36 KJV)
The basic entry requirement for the Christians is a profession of faith, in Christ, and a life of righteousness. Christians are called to a higher standard than ordinary people.
No other knowledge of bible events is necessary and this can be proven by the simple fact that there was no bible for people to study in the time of the early church.
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01 Feb 22
@Ghost-of-a-Duke
And you:
A. The world's leading defender in what you don't believe?
B. A closet believer who can't stand to be identified as one?
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@rajk999 saidThe Old Testament didn’t exist at the time of the early church?
The basic requirement for entry into the Kingdom of God is this, and this alone ... Doing the good works Jesus described summarised as charitable brotherly love to those around.
[i] .... Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a ...[text shortened]... ated by the simple fact that there was no bible for people to study in the time of the early church.
The last book of the Old Testament was written 500 years before Jesus Christ’s earthly ministry.
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@rajk999 saidThe Holy Bible contains *numerous* examples of Jesus Christ referencing and quoting from the Old Testament. Here’s just one example.
The basic requirement for entry into the Kingdom of God is this, and this alone ... Doing the good works Jesus described summarised as charitable brotherly love to those around.
[i] .... Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a ...[text shortened]... oven by the simple fact that there was no bible for people to study in the time of the early church.
“And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.
But their eyes were holden that they should not know him.
And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad?
And the one of them, whose name was Cleopas, answering said unto him, Art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which are come to pass there in these days?
And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people:
And how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death, and have crucified him.
But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the third day since these things were done.
Yea, and certain women also of our company made us astonished, which were early at the sepulchre;
And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive.
And certain of them which were with us went to the sepulchre, and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not.
Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.”
(Luke 24:15-27)
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01 Feb 22
@fmf saidAlso, I believe the supernatural manifested itself much more often back then and while supernatural events would seem shocking to most people if they happened today, I don’t think that was the case back then.Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.
Are Christians obliged to believe and to assert that this really happened?
01 Feb 22
1 edit
@pb1022 saidWhat are your grounds for this bizarre belief?
Also, I believe the supernatural manifested itself much more often back then and while supernatural events would seem shocking to most people if they happened today, I don’t think that was the case back then.
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01 Feb 22
@avalanchethecat saidWhat’s bizarre about it?
What are your grounds for this bizarre belief?