1. Standard memberapathist
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    04 Aug '17 06:42
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    I've always wondered why if we survive a horrible event then it was due to god. So who was responsible for all the non-survivors?
  2. Standard memberKellyJay
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    04 Aug '17 08:44
    Originally posted by @apathist
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIBNpo8-7aY

    I've always wondered why if we survive a horrible event then it was due to god. So who was responsible for all the non-survivors?
    God gives and takes away.
  3. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 09:07
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    God gives and takes away.
    Is that not the same basis for the moral compass of gangsterism or corrupt hierarchies of authoritarian power?

    What is the moral inspiration that humans generally are supposed to take when we follow Christians all the way up their ideological river and all we get is Colonel Kurtz-type pronouncements like this?
  4. Standard memberchaney3
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    04 Aug '17 09:10
    Originally posted by @fmf
    Is that not the same basis for the moral compass of gangsterism or corrupt hierarchies of authoritarian power?

    What is the moral inspiration that humans generally are supposed to take when we follow Christians all the way up their ideological river and all we get is Colonel Kurtz-type pronouncements like this?
    Ummmm....who are you talking to?
  5. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 09:15
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    Ummmm....who are you talking to?
    Anybody who is reading. The supposed moral foundation/explanation KellyJay appears to be citing strikes me as incoherent in so far as it is not a moral foundation that humans can emulate or apply themselves, except in the worst kinds of political regimes and criminal rackets. I wonder what KellyJay thinks. What do you think?
  6. Standard memberchaney3
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    04 Aug '17 09:21
    Originally posted by @fmf
    Anybody who is reading. The supposed moral foundation/explanation KellyJay appears to be citing strikes me as incoherent in so far as it is not a moral foundation that humans can emulate or apply themselves, except in the worst kinds of political regimes and criminal rackets. I wonder what KellyJay thinks. What do you think?
    I will say this.
    If 25 people die in a plane crash, but there's one survivor who says "thank God".

    Does that imply God didn't care about the dead?

    It's a good thread, for once, by apathist.
  7. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 09:24
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    I will say this.
    If 25 people die in a plane crash, but there's one survivor who says "thank God".

    Does that imply God didn't care about the dead?
    KellyJay has offered God gives and takes away, as would many Christians.

    Does it work for you? It seems to me to be a kind of cop-out explanation, morally speaking.
  8. Standard memberKellyJay
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    04 Aug '17 09:39
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    I will say this.
    If 25 people die in a plane crash, but there's one survivor who says "thank God".

    Does that imply God didn't care about the dead?

    It's a good thread, for once, by apathist.
    He actually comes up with good ones a lot in my opinion. Think about this, God who is
    Almighty, All knowing, Who is every where, Eternal in time and space would see every
    atom, proton, and so on down the to smallest particle, and the whole expanse of the whole
    universe at once. He would know each detail in perfect knowledge not being bound by
    time, and the whole, and how it all works together at the same time.

    This is the one that formed us in our mother's womb, who has plans for us that the
    scriptures say is so wonderful it has not even entered into the mind of man what is
    about to come. Death and time for Him would be nothing, evil in all of its power is also
    nothing but a bump in the road. The struggle isn't by power, it isn't by strength or
    wisdom, it is by love and evil in us.

    God gave us the ability to choose, for a purpose, what that purpose is remains to be
    seen, but we know it isn't because this life is all there is. We are told that this life and all
    in it are temporary, that if we gain the whole world and lose our souls what does it matter?

    The real questions in this life isn't who lives and dies, it is what one does with Jesus, and
    how we treat one another. Do we live a life of love, or self centeredness?
  9. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 09:481 edit
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    He actually comes up with good ones a lot in my opinion. Think about this, God who is
    Almighty, All knowing, Who is every where, Eternal in time and space would see every
    atom, proton, and so on down the to smallest particle, and the whole expanse of the whole
    universe at once. He would know each detail in perfect knowledge not being bound by
    time, and ...[text shortened]... does with Jesus, and
    how we treat one another. Do we live a life of love, or self centeredness?
    Do you think the one survivor of the plane crash (in the OP) would be right to thank god for taking away the lives of all the other passengers instead of his? And would the family members of the dead passengers be right to thank god for exercising "perfect knowledge" and wisdom in taking away the lives of their relatives?
  10. Standard memberchaney3
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    04 Aug '17 09:56
    Originally posted by @fmf
    Do you think the one survivor of the plane crash (in the OP) would be right to thank god for taking away the lives of all the other passengers instead of his? And would the family members of the dead passengers be right to thank god for exercising "perfect knowledge" and wisdom in taking away the lives of their relatives?
    Who are you talking to?

    You and Dive continue to arrogantly ignore the problem.
  11. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 10:03
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    Who are you talking to?
    Anybody who is reading. There are ideas being put on the table here. Addressing them is what the forum is for.
  12. Standard memberchaney3
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    04 Aug '17 10:09
    Originally posted by @fmf
    Anybody who is reading. There are ideas being put on the table here. Addressing them is what the forum is for.
    Stop being arrogant.

    Fix this FMF.
  13. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 10:17
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    If 25 people die in a plane crash, but there's one survivor who says "thank God". Does that imply God didn't care about the dead?
    Does KellyJay's answer - God gives and takes away - suffice for you? It seems to me to lack a moral perspective rather than provide one. The nearest "morality" of authority to this that humans have is the rationale of murderous dictatorships. Is there some other moral lesson or paradigm in it that I am not seeing? What do you think?
  14. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 10:35
    Originally posted by @apathist
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIBNpo8-7aY
    The drawback of videos like this is that it's a couple of erudite people with organized thoughts beating up on a rather dull, inarticulate guy with half-baked thoughts. Why don't these atheists tackle calls from their intellectual counterparts among theists? It would make for better entertainment.
  15. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Aug '17 10:38
    Originally posted by @fmf
    The drawback of videos like this is that it's a couple of erudite people with organized thoughts beating up on a rather dull, inarticulate guy with half-baked thoughts.
    Talking of which, I'm sorry chaney3 if you end up making a fool of yourself pretty much every time you engage me. 😛
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