Muslims kill endangered tiger

Originally posted by Proper Knob
Robbie i have question that i'm hoping you might be able to answer. Galveston75 is refusing to answer it, i personally don't think he has the brain power to do it.

If God didn't write the Bible, how can the Bible then be Gods word?

The Bible claims to be the INSPIRED word of God. So the question becomes, how close does the actual word mirror what God had inspired men to write of him?

From my perspective the closest thing we have to actually talking to God are the teachings of Jesus. That is because I believe him to be God in the flesh.

Originally posted by whodey
Since when do I ignore other sins. The sad fact of the matter is that all you talk about is homosexuality and the fact that all christians are hypocrites and going to hell.

Since when do I ignore other sins.

Are you now claiming that you rebuke all manner of sin including greed, gluttony, etc.? How many overweight people in your congregation have you rebuked in the past year? Living in the US, I'd think it likely that there are plenty.

And once again:
"You judge homosexuals as UNFIT to be members or leaders of your church even though you allow those with other sins including yourself."

You ignore your own sins and the sins of others when judging who is and who is not fit to be members or leaders of your church.

The sad fact of the matter is that all you talk about is homosexuality and the fact that all christians are hypocrites and going to hell.

Why do you keep making these baseless charges? When have I ever said that "all christians are hypocrites and going to hell." I call YOU a hypocrite because that's what you are. I suppose if you assert that you're the only christian, then you might have something there.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes, does it not strike you as hypocritical, here we are, standing up for what is written in the pages of Gods word, and suddenly we are the bigots and the hypocrites. i feel it is much better to read our friend thinkofones messages when you delete the adjectives. you should try it, you can get the sense of what he is saying without the baggage.

Evidently you had trouble comprehending the following the first time I posted it in response to a similar assertion that you made:
What qualifies as bigotry is ostracizing homosexuals even though they allow themselves and others their own sins and "abominations".

If they're going to hide behind the Bible as the "revealed word of God" then they'd better apply it to the greedy, gluttons, liars, etc as well. They also better apply it to eaters of pork and shellfish, wearers of cloth made from more than one fiber such as cotton / polyester bends, etc. This picking and choosing passages that they deem to support their bigotry is nothing but hypocrisy.

If there are any sentences, phrases or words that you don't understand, just point them out and I'll try to clarify.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
"You judge homosexuals as UNFIT to be members or leaders of your church even though you allow those with other sins including yourself."

But that is not my position. Once again, you have misjudged me. Someone may be a homosexual and be a leader in my church, however, if they are engaged in a homosexual activity, and openly so, then they would be in violation of Biblical teachings.

The whole crux of the matter is that you do not interpret the Biblical passages to be condemning homosexual unions. At least, not in the Old Testament. From what I can gather you have little use for Paul and judge him as harshly as you judge myself in regards to his teachings on the matter.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
[b]Since when do I ignore other sins.

Are you now claiming that you rebuke all manner of sin including greed, gluttony, etc.? How many overweight people in your congregation have you rebuked in the past year? Living in the US, I'd think it likely that there are plenty.

We all have "issues" and when they are evident in the church they should be and ARE addressed accordingly. So as for the glutton, they would be approached. Now the simple fact that they have an issue with it or any other sin is not a reason to dismiss them. Otherwise the church would soon be without leaders However, if they dismiss the correction and continue to openly sin and even promote certain "sinful" activities they will be dismissed.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Why do you keep making these baseless charges? When have I ever said that "all christians are hypocrites and going to hell." I call YOU a hypocrite because that's what you are. I suppose if you assert that you're the only christian, then you might have something there.[/b]

So some Christians are not hypocrites and are not going to hell? Let me guess, it is ONLY the ones that do not condemn the homosexual lifestyle. Am I right?

Originally posted by whodey
But that is not my position. Once again, you have misjudged me. Someone may be a homosexual and be a leader in my church, however, if they are engaged in a homosexual activity, and openly so, then they would be in violation of Biblical teachings.

The whole crux of the matter is that you do not interpret the Biblical passages to be condemning homosexual u ...[text shortened]... for Paul and judge him as harshly as you judge myself in regards to his teachings on the matter.

Are not the sins of other members and leaders of your church "in violation of Biblical teachings"? Are not YOUR sins "in violation of Biblical teachings"?

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Are not the sins of other members and leaders of your church "in violation of Biblical teachings"? Are not YOUR sins "in violation of Biblical teachings"?

The whole issue here is being in a position of authority, which means that people look up to you and, consequenlty, naturally adopt some of the morals you may have. So if you are teaching, either by example or by indoctrination, things that run contrary to the Bible then you should be removed because you should be reflecting the authority of God's law.

Now there are those sins which are not out in the open and are between you and God. As for those issues, that is between you and your God. However, those things which you openly do effect others that you are in authority over.

Originally posted by whodey
The whole issue here is being in a position of authority, which means that people look up to you and, consequenlty, naturally adopt some of the morals you may have. So if you are teaching, either by example or by indoctrination, things that run contrary to the Bible then you should be removed because you should be reflecting the authority of God's law.

No ...[text shortened]... r God. However, those things which you openly do effect others that you are in authority over.

Well, I guess maybe I didn't understand your position in its entirety.

Is it your position that so long as homosexuals don't have sex in front of the congregation, they would be accepted as members and leaders? And that this goes for heterosexuals as well?

Originally posted by whodey
We all have "issues" and when they are evident in the church they should be and ARE addressed accordingly. So as for the glutton, they would be approached. Now the simple fact that they have an issue with it or any other sin is not a reason to dismiss them. Otherwise the church would soon be without leaders However, if they dismiss the correction and continue to openly sin and even promote certain "sinful" activities they will be dismissed.

Once again:
"How many overweight people in your congregation have you rebuked in the past year? Living in the US, I'd think it likely that there are plenty."

How many of them dismissed the correction and continued to be overweight? Were they all dismissed?

ok, what is it about the Mosaic law now being obsolete that you do not understand? perhaps giving your time simply to the words of Christ has left you bereft of knowledge of other parts of the bible, apparently it would appear so!

please go away and learn what this means:

(Colossians 2:13-14) . . .He kindly forgave us all our trespasses and blotted out the handwritten document against us, which consisted of decrees and which was in opposition to us; and He has taken it out of the way by nailing it to the torture stake.

if you are having trouble i will help you.

now the proper procedure for dealing with sin is also laid out in Gods Word. If it is a minor sin, its is covered over with love,

(1 Peter 4:8) . . .Above all things, have intense love for one another, because love covers a multitude of sins.

if it is a serious sin that will bring reproach upon the congregation, and reflect badly upon the Christ, then there are also procedures for dealing with this. i have neither the time nor the inclination to go into them in depth. if i thought that you were interested in learning what they are, i might be persuaded, but i honestly think that you just want an argument. Suffice to say that Christ himself set the pattern, please also try to learn and understand the import of these words, once again, if you find anything that is ambiguous, then please let me know.

(Matthew 18:15-17) . . .“Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, in order that at the mouth of two or three witnesses every matter may be established.  If he does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector.

you will note that there are three parts to the above, 1: speaking to the individual personally and trying to resolve the difficulty, 2.taking along others that the matter may be firmly established and resolved, 3.speaking to the congregation.

Paul also provided extensive details on how to deal with serious sins, but the post is long enough already.

Originally posted by whodey
So some Christians are not hypocrites and are not going to hell? Let me guess, it is ONLY the ones that do not condemn the homosexual lifestyle. Am I right?

Evidently you really have absolutely no idea of what I've been posting. Evidently you really are incapable of making the distinctions that I've been making.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Evidently you really have absolutely no idea of what I've been posting. Evidently you really are incapable of making the distinctions that I've been making.

Let me put it another way, what if I were a teacher in authority over you and I continue to believe as I do? You have two options, you could quite coming to that particular religious institution or you could have me removed. Of course, this is because you think I am in violation of God's law.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Paul also provided extensive details on how to deal with serious sins, but the post is long enough already.[/b]

Er...um....thanks for that but I don't think TOO has any respect for Paul as a theologian. Of course, if I am wrong TOO is welcomed to REBUKE ME!!!

Originally posted by whodey
Er...um....thanks for that but I don't think TOO has any respect for Paul as a theologian. Of course, if I am wrong TOO is welcomed to REBUKE ME!!!

no worries whodey my friend, whether our friend has respect for Paul or not is neither here nor there, he did not inspire the Bible writers, did he?. That Christ himself clearly states that a person should be treated as either a tax collector, or a person of the nations, is not easily refuted by his all embracing ideology!