Obedience vs Disobedience

-Removed-

Did God make rules for us to follow? Does each person have the same rules or are they different for each person? It's a simple question. Do you refer to the 10 commandments as the 10 suggestions?

Originally posted by @dj2becker
Deep down we all know it's true because God has written the law on all our hearts. How else could you account for the fact that we all are certain that rape is always wrong ?

Neither of these sentences is demonstrably true. You and I are in agreement that we think (or believe or feel) that the act of rape is, as far as we can conceive, always wrong. Does it therefore follow that the act of rape is always wrong? No, of course not. It is naive, nay, asinine to believe that for all people in all times what you and I believe now, in this society at this time, should hold true.

I am sure you are aware that the act of rape is implicitly condoned in the scripture you profess to hold so dear. Does that not strike you as somewhat odd for an act that you hold to be contrary to your god-given morality?

Edit:
To muddy the waters still further, homosexuality is a crime to be punished by death according to your scripture. In our time, however, this is considered to be perfectly acceptable to most right-thinking people. Did your god change his mind and re-write that particular part of the "law on all our hearts"?

Originally posted by @avalanchethecat
Neither of these sentences is demonstrably true. You and I are in agreement that we think (or believe or feel) that the act of rape is, as far as we can conceive, always wrong. Does it therefore follow that the act of rape is always wrong? No, of course not. It is naive, nay, asinine to believe that for all people in all times what you and I ...[text shortened]... . Did your god change his mind and re-write that particular part of the "law on all our hearts"?

I think it is perfectly reasonable to think that rape is always wrong, if you don't agree feel free to provide a situation where it isn't.

Romans 1:28

Furthermore, since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, He gave them up to a depraved mind, to do what should not be done.

God hasn't changed His mind.

Originally posted by @dj2becker
I think it is perfectly reasonable to think that rape is always wrong, if you don't agree feel free to provide a situation where it isn't.

Romans 1:28

Furthermore, since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, He gave them up to a depraved mind, to do what should not be done.

God hasn't changed His mind.

I am not here to educate you, fetchmyjunk. If you take the time to educate yourself you will find that there are some cultures even today where forced sex within marriage is considered perfectly reasonable and morally correct behaviour. This attitude has been rather more prevalent in the past:

(quote from Wikipedia) "Sir Matthew Hale, in his 1736 legal treatise Historia Placitorum Coronæ or History of the Pleas of the Crown, .... wrote that such a rape could not be recognized since the wife "hath given up herself in this kind unto her husband, which she cannot retract.""

So you consider homosexuality to be always morally wrong?

Originally posted by @avalanchethecat
...you will find that there are some cultures even today where forced sex within marriage is considered perfectly reasonable and morally correct behaviour.
(quote from Wikipedia) "Sir Matthew Hale, in his 1736 legal treatise Historia Placitorum Coronæ or History of the Pleas of the Crown, .... wrote that such a rape could not be recognized since the wife "hath given up herself in this kind unto her husband, which she cannot retract.""

This kind of rape was something robbie carrobie endorsed for 30-40 thread pages once although he later seemed to want people to think it was just one of his cheeky chappie rhetorical "comedy" routines. He also had "comedy" discourse routines about the benefits of covering up child sex abuse and about lynching black people.

Originally posted by @fmf
This kind of rape was something robbie carrobie endorsed for 30-40 thread pages once although he later seemed to want people to think it was just one of his cheeky chappie rhetorical "comedy" routines. He also had "comedy" discourse routines about the benefits of covering up child sex abuse and about lynching black people.

Yes, that was an amusing about-face.

Originally posted by @avalanchethecat
I am not here to educate you, fetchmyjunk. If you take the time to educate yourself you will find that there are some cultures even today where forced sex within marriage is considered perfectly reasonable and morally correct behaviour. This attitude has been rather more prevalent in the past:

(quote from Wikipedia) "Sir Matthew Hale, in his 1736 ...[text shortened]... usband, which she cannot retract.""

So you consider homosexuality to be always morally wrong?

So do you think rape within marriage is morally acceptable? Surely we can both agree its still wrong regardless.

Originally posted by @dj2becker
So do you think rape within marriage is morally acceptable? Surely we can both agree its still wrong regardless.

I think I have stated very clearly that I do not think rape within marriage is morally acceptable. You have stated that "rape is always wrong" and that "deep down we all know it's true because God has written the law on all our hearts". I have pointed out to you that that is not so, and that in other times and in other cultures than our own, rape of one kind or another has been considered to be morally acceptable by right-thinking people.

Is the biblical proscription regarding homosexuality a part of your canon of objective morality?

Originally posted by @avalanchethecat
I think I have stated very clearly that I do not think rape within marriage is morally acceptable. You have stated that "rape is always wrong" and that "deep down we all know it's true because God has written the law on all our hearts". I have pointed out to you that that is not so, and that in other times and in other cultures than our own, rape of ...[text shortened]... Is the biblical proscription regarding homosexuality a part of your canon of objective morality?

How can you say it has been done by right-thinking people when you yourself say it's wrong. Surely you would consider yourself to be the right-thinking person?

Originally posted by @dj2becker
How can you say it has been done by right-thinking people when you yourself say it's wrong. Surely you would consider yourself to be the right-thinking person?

I have studied history and anthropology quite extensively, and it is quite apparent to me that what I hold to be morally correct does not hold for all people for all time. I find the death penalty to be morally repugnant, for instance. I know full well that some of the christians on this board hold contrary views, and consider themselves morally right to do so. This is why I am unable to agree with your stance on moral absolutism.

Originally posted by @avalanchethecat
I have studied history and anthropology quite extensively, and it is quite apparent to me that what I hold to be morally correct does not hold for all people for all time. I find the death penalty to be morally repugnant, for instance. I know full well that some of the christians on this board hold contrary views, and consider themselves morally right to do so. This is why I am unable to agree with your stance on moral absolutism.

If you subscribe to moral absolutism it means you believe that certain actions are always wrong regardless of the circumstances. You seem to subscribe to moral absolutism since you have said that rape is always wrong.

Originally posted by @dj2becker
If you subscribe to moral absolutism it means you believe that certain actions are always wrong regardless of the circumstances. You seem to subscribe to moral absolutism since you have said that rape is always wrong.

No, that is what you said. If you go back and read what I said you will see that it is subtly different. Furthermore, I have given you clear evidence that in the past, certain types of rape at least were not viewed in this way.

I note your persistent failure to consider my wider points. Should I presume that you are quite happy about the idea having all practicing homosexuals stoned to death?

-Removed-

For us humans I believe there should only be one objective moral standard. In other words what God says is evil remains evil regardless of what anyone may think about it.