Originally posted by Proper Knob
[b]There are many "unknowns". God has not revealed everything to us. And Paul knew much more than what he told us in the New Testament. Some revelation he kept to himself. He took that knowledge with him to the grave.
If he took it to the grave, how do you know he kept some to himself?
And if he did, wasn't that a little selfish?[/b]
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If he took it to the grave, how do you know he kept some to himself?
And if he did, wasn't that a little selfish?
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Pretty good questions there.
Paul had an experience of being carried away into Paradise and up to the third heavens. He said he heard unspeakable things. And as far as we can tell he kept it to himself or 14 years. The details of the experience he did not devulge.
Paul wrote about these experiences when the troublesome church in Corinth questioned the authenticity of his apostleship. He was forced to boast as a fool about his experience and revelations. He did not want to do so. You may read for yourself this forced self vindication in
2 Corinthians 12:1-12. However I would encourage you to read the full context which would roughly be
Second Corinthians 10:1 through to 13:10.
They Corinthian church were suspicious of his motives, much like modern day skeptics. They challenged his credentials, much like modern day skeptics. They forced compelled him to have to speak up for the depth of his experience.
"To boast is necessry, though indeed not expedient; yet I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. I know a man in Christ, fourteen years ago (whether in the body I do not know, or outside the body I do not know; God knows) such a man was caught away to the third heaven.
And I know such a man (whether in the body or outside the body, I do not know; God knows), that he was caught away into Paradise and heard unspeakable words, which is is not allowed for a man to speak.
On behalf of such a one I will boast, but on behalf of myself I will not boast, except in my weaknesses. (2 Cor. 10:1-5)
Now as to your second point - was Paul being selfish to withhold the details of these visits to Heaven and to Paradise (two different placed) ?
I do not think Paul was being selfish. I do think that Paul was resisting the sensationalism of the experiences. I do think that in his wisdom what he deemed more useful to the saints was how to endure hardships through the grace of Christ. That is why he said he woud rather boast in his weaknesses. It is how Christ empowered him through his trials, difficulties, troubles, anxieties, and problems that Paul regarded of
more practical use to the church.
Now, consider the maturity of this minister compared to the sensational preaching of some Christian workers today. Some ministers, if they had an experience like that would be proclaiming it on TV the next evening. Paul kept the matter to himself for at least
14 years !
So Mr. Knob, I do not think Paul was selfish in concealing the details. Rather he was wise that this information would be little more than a sensational distraction from the saints learning to enjoy the grace of Christ through daily weaknesses and trials.
Listen to how Paul uses his transcendent experience to edify the Christians:
"And because of the transcendence of the revelations, in order that I might not be lifted up, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan, that he might buffet me, in order that I might not be exceedingly lifted up.
Concerning this I entreated the Lord three times that it might depart from me. And He has said to me,
My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is perfected in weakness.
Most gladly therefore I will rather boast in my weakness that the power of Christ might tabernacle over me. Therefore I AM WELL PLEASED IN WEAKNESSES, IN INSULTS, IN NECESSITIES, IN PERSECUTIONS AND DISTRESSES, ON BEHALF OF CHRIST; FOR WHEN I AM WEAK, THEN I AM POWERFUL" (2 Cor. 12:7-10 my emphasis)
In other words Paul deemed it more helpful to the church to demonstrate how the grace of Christ upheld him in daily problems. He is powerful when he has to depend on Christ.
He deemed it less important in this case to talk about sensational transports to these supernatural realms, the experiences of which almost caused him to have spiritual pride which needed to be checked by subsequent humbling suffering in his flesh.
The world is quite fortunate to have the ministry of such a mature servant of God. It is no wonder that he authored some 13 of the 27 New Testament books. God could COUNT on him.