Questions from a non-religious person

Originally posted by RJHinds
Here you will find a pie chart on religious populations of the world:

http://www.age-of-the-sage.org/mysticism/world_religions_populations.htm

Interesting chart!

It says that there are twice as more non-christian people than christian people. What does that say? I rather stay non-christian if I want to belong to the majority.

The text on your link says
"Christians: 2,100,000,000 - tending to decline in terms of global percentage"
...and it's not getting better.

Originally posted by whodey
This is because the vast majority of people on earth subscribe to the God of the Bible. The world is basically split between Islam and Christianity and to a lesser degree Judaism.

So Islam and Christianity follow the same god?
(Same origins ... very different interpretation)

and you think the world is split between Christians and Muslims with
"to a lesser degree" Jews? (less than 1% I think)

You need to broaden your thinking.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Interesting chart!

It says that there are twice as more non-christian people than christian people. What does that say? I rather stay non-christian if I want to belong to the majority.

The text on your link says
"Christians: 2,100,000,000 - tending to decline in terms of global percentage"
...and it's not getting better.

Actually the number of Christians I'd say is even smaller, because not
everyone who claims to be one is one. With are charts we take anyone
who makes the claim.
Kelly

Many Christians?
What do these verses refer to?

King James Version
================
Jude 1: 14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Deuteronomy 33: 2
And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.

Originally posted by KingOnPoint
Googlefudge,
You Typed
----------------
What makes you think that free will DOES in fact exist...
----------------

Do you think that God made people on RHP play chess? That is free will. What does chess mean to God? Is chess an eternal necessity? Men and women play chess for their own reasons.

I don't think god made people do anything. Gods don't exist.

And no the fact that we play chess doesn't mean free will exists...

Free will is generally defined as being that in a situation where you made
a choice you could have chosen differently from the choice you did in fact
make.

And I would agree with Sam Harris' arguments that demonstrate quite clearly
that we do not in fact have any ability to choose other than the choices we
actually made/make.

Free will doesn't exist, and indeed cannot exist.

Originally posted by googlefudge
I don't think god made people do anything. Gods don't exist.

And no the fact that we play chess doesn't mean free will exists...

Free will is generally defined as being that in a situation where you made
a choice you could have chosen differently from the choice you did in fact
make.

And I would agree with Sam Harris' arguments that demonstr ...[text shortened]... r than the choices we
actually made/make.

Free will doesn't exist, and indeed cannot exist.

So we shouldn't argue with stupid people ... they have no choice.


... but we can't stop arguing with them .... we have no chose!

Originally posted by googlefudge
I don't think god made people do anything. Gods don't exist.

And no the fact that we play chess doesn't mean free will exists...

Free will is generally defined as being that in a situation where you made
a choice you could have chosen differently from the choice you did in fact
make.

And I would agree with Sam Harris' arguments that demonstr ...[text shortened]... r than the choices we
actually made/make.

Free will doesn't exist, and indeed cannot exist.

I'm pretty sure we've already eliminated Sam Harris' take on free will as incoherent nonsense.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
I'm pretty sure we've already eliminated Sam Harris' take on free will as incoherent nonsense.

"We" being the voices in your head. 😛

Originally posted by googlefudge
I don't think god made people do anything. Gods don't exist.

And no the fact that we play chess doesn't mean free will exists...

Free will is generally defined as being that in a situation where you made
a choice you could have chosen differently from the choice you did in fact
make.

And I would agree with Sam Harris' arguments that demonstr ...[text shortened]... r than the choices we
actually made/make.

Free will doesn't exist, and indeed cannot exist.

That's why many people (Compatibilists) don't care for that definition of free will.

GoogleFudge,
If we can do different things over a period of time such as murder someone and save someone else's life next, then murder again, how can you say that we don't choose to do these things?

Who is making us murder, then save a life, then murder again?

Also, God will not make us put faith in Christ for eternal life, we must make a decision and act on it.

Originally posted by SwissGambit
That's why many people (Compatibilists) don't care for that definition of free will.

True. But compatibilist free will doesn't do what the theists want free will to do.

And personally I think that Compatibilists are just trying to define free will into
existence when what they are talking about doesn't do what most people would
naively think free will is supposed to do.

Just as you can define god to be 'everything'... well everything exists... I just don't
think calling it [everything] god gets you anywhere.

Nothing resembling what most people think of as free will exists, thus free will doesn't
exist.

This is only a problem if you make the mistake of founding either laws or morality on the
assumption that it does.

As this is both unnecessary and unhelpful I say lets just drop the whole unhelpful concept
of free will altogether.

Originally posted by KingOnPoint
GoogleFudge,
If we can do different things over a period of time such as murder someone and save someone else's life next, then murder again, how can you say that we don't choose to do these things?

Who is making us murder, then save a life, then murder again?

Also, God will not make us put faith in Christ for eternal life, we must make a decision and act on it.

A computer sends out a virus that disables a life support machine, then
completes a gene folding operation that enables the curing of cancer...

Does this computer have free will?

Also try to keep god out of the discussion, as I know god doesn't exist it's
a pointless waste of your time and a distraction from the discussion at hand.

GoogleFudge,
The people that made the computer function under parameters have freewill. The computer does what it was set up to do by man.

God gave man his own choic,e and it is our own choice to reject God's way of salvation. We change our minds and act on our own will. It isn't the human law that keeps man from killing someone. It is a single man's choice to not murder. There are so many choices of man that get fulfilled over and over in this world. It happens in government, science, education, and individual, personal decisions. Believing that humans don't make their own choices is a falsehood. To tell someone that he or she can't make up their own mind is a lie.

Originally posted by googlefudge
True. But compatibilist free will doesn't do what the theists want free will to do.

And personally I think that Compatibilists are just trying to define free will into
existence when what they are talking about doesn't do what most people would
naively think free will is supposed to do.

Just as you can define god to be 'everything'... well ever ...[text shortened]... essary and unhelpful I say lets just drop the whole unhelpful concept
of free will altogether.

But it is not 'unhelpful' nor 'unnecessary'. We cannot have moral accountability without free will. Why do you think otherwise?

Originally posted by googlefudge

And I would agree with Sam Harris' arguments that demonstrate quite clearly that we do not in fact have any ability to choose other than the choices we actually made/make.

Free will doesn't exist, and indeed cannot exist.

Does it follow then that outrage over crime, wrong doing, and injustice are unwarranted since offenders could not but do what they chose to do ?

Does it follow then that you and Sam Harris should not be upset over the rise of theism ?
Some had no other choice but to concoct gods ?