Red Letter Christians

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Not sure what you have in mind here. If you had written "Red Letter Christian", I would have said, "No". My view of the Bible does coincide with how they have defined themselves in the article cited in the OP. However, there is overlap in the emphasis put on the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.

Explain your terms and you'll get a better answer. I imagine that you might need to define what you mean by "Christian" as well.

As per your OP and thread title. I'm trying to understand you a little.

Are you any type of recognised (lose term) Christian? If so which one please?
Are you theist?
Atheist?
Other?

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Perhaps in time they'll come out of the shadows and explain themselves.

I doubt it but stranger things have transpired

Originally posted by @divegeester
As per your OP and thread title. I'm trying to understand you a little.

Are you any type of recognised (lose term) Christian? If so which one please?
Are you theist?
Atheist?
Other?

Sorry my previous post to you should have read:

Not sure what you have in mind here. If you had written "Red Letter Christian", I would have said, "No". My view of the Bible does NOT coincide with how they have defined themselves in the article cited in the OP. However, there is overlap in the emphasis put on the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.

Explain your terms and you'll get a better answer. I imagine that you might need to define what you mean by "Christian" as well.

It really would help if you were to define what you mean by "Christian". By my understanding of how the word is typically defined, no I am not a "Christian". As I've stated many times before, rather I am an advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.

I'll also add what I've posted many times before:

By and large, I find the words attributed to Jesus while He walked the Earth to be reasonably sound and reasonably coherent within themselves. What's more, I find much of what was attributed to Him to be remarkably deep and quite profound. As such, by and large, I find the words attributed to Jesus while He walked the Earth to be "true".

I don't share that view of the mythology and beliefs that the NT writers wrapped around them. At best, they can merely echo His words. At worst, they deviate from His words and at times substantially so.

I certainly don't share many of the beliefs espoused by many Christians - many of which are antithetical to what Jesus taught while He walked the Earth.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Sorry my previous post to you should have read:

Not sure what you have in mind here. If you had written "Red Letter Christian", I would have said, "No". My view of the Bible does [b]NOT coincide with how they have defined themselves in the article cited in the OP. However, there is overlap in the emphasis put on the gospel preached by Jesus d ...[text shortened]... ians - many of which are antithetical to what Jesus taught while He walked the Earth.

[/b]

By Christian I would say - believes that Jesus was the son of god and his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins. I’d say that was the traditional non controversial Christian view of Jesus.

You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?

Originally posted by @divegeester
By Christian I would say - believes that Jesus was the son of god and his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins. I’d say that was the traditional non controversial Christian view of Jesus.

You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?

You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?

In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He repeatedly calls for His followers to understand, believe, follow and ultimately abide in His word. To be clear, to abide in the words He preached during His ministry.

In short, to be a "follower of Him" IS to abide in the words He preached during His ministry.

By Christian I would say - believes that Jesus was the son of god and his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins. I’d say that was the traditional non controversial Christian view of Jesus.

By that definition I am not a Christian. In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He calls for His followers to become sons of God as He was a son of God. He calls for His followers to become one with God as He was one with God.

He did not teach "his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins".

Originally posted by @karoly-aczel
I doubt it but stranger things have transpired

Agreed.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
[b]You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?

In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He repeatedly calls for His followers to understand, believe, follow and ultimately abide in His word. To be clear, to abide in the words He preached during His ministry.

In short, to be a "follower of Him" IS to abide i ...[text shortened]... .

He did not teach "his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins".[/b]

Thanks a really interesting perspective and one I've not come across before. I like that you have a clear perspective but won't be classified. Do you mind if I press you for more info - I'm inquiring sincerely.

Would you say that Jesus was human not deity?
Do you believe there is a deity at all?
Would you say you follow the teachings/words of Jesus but are not a theist?
In other words would it be fair to say that you are fairly close to being a agnostic humanist who happens to like the words of Christ?

Originally posted by @divegeester
Thanks a really interesting perspective and one I've not come across before. I like that you have a clear perspective but won't be classified. Do you mind if I press you for more info - I'm inquiring sincerely.

Would you say that Jesus was human not deity?
Do you believe there is a deity at all?
Would you say you follow the teachings/words of Jesu ...[text shortened]... that you are fairly close to being a agnostic humanist who happens to like the words of Christ?

Can't speak for ToO, but you have pretty much described my position.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Thanks a really interesting perspective and one I've not come across before. I like that you have a clear perspective but won't be classified. Do you mind if I press you for more info - I'm inquiring sincerely.

Would you say that Jesus was human not deity?
Do you believe there is a deity at all?
Would you say you follow the teachings/words of Jesu ...[text shortened]... that you are fairly close to being a agnostic humanist who happens to like the words of Christ?

In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God or the literal Son of God. I've yet to come across anyone who could make a cogent argument that Jesus claimed to be God, They don't seem to care what Jesus actually said or didn't say - not just about this, but in general. The following excerpt from what I posted in the OP seems to speak to this phenomenon:

Because Evangelicals have been steeped in the theology of the Pauline Epistles before they scrutinise the teachings of Jesus in the red letters of the Bible, they have read Jesus through the eyes of Paul.

But the root seems to be more insidious than this. One would think that - given that they call Jesus "Lord", that they call themselves "followers of Jesus", etc. - all Christians would have dedicated themselves to understanding the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry. All Christians would have devoted themselves to identifying the underlying concepts and overarching themes in an effort to get a handle on what Jesus was trying to get across.

But it's difficult to find any who have. In fact the only person I've come across who seems to have done anything approaching this is rajk999. What's more, by and large Christians I've had discussion with seem to have little interest in doing so. And the ones who have shown interest fail to do so. Perhaps it's because so many are so steeped in the mythology of what freakykbh I believe called "The Golden Ticket". This is what they seem to have devoted themselves to.

Any interest in what I've been writing on this thread?

Any interest in the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Originally posted by @thinkofone
In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God or the literal Son of God. I've yet to come across anyone who could make a cogent argument that Jesus claimed to be God, They don't seem to care what Jesus actually said or didn't say - not just about this, but in general. The following excerpt from what I posted in the OP se ...[text shortened]... een writing on this thread?

Any interest in the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God or the literal Son of God.>>

I don’t think this is accurate. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least two instances and a third instance is from God the Father.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
[b]You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?

In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He repeatedly calls for His followers to understand, believe, follow and ultimately abide in His word. To be clear, to abide in the words He preached during His ministry.

In short, to be a "follower of Him" IS to abide i ...[text shortened]... .

He did not teach "his sacrificial death at Calvary was done to provide atonement of sins".[/b]

Are you saying Jesus did not speak of the New Covenant with His disciples prior to His crucifixion?

Originally posted by @romans1009
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God or the literal Son of God.>>

I don’t think this is accurate. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least two instances and a third instance is from God the Father.

This isn’t one of the instances I was thinking of, but the earthly reason for Jesus’ crucifixion was His claim to be the Son of God, which the Pharisees thought was blasphemy.

“Then Pilate therefore took Jesus, and scourged him.

And the soldiers platted a crown of thorns, and put it on his head, and they put on him a purple robe,

And said, Hail, King of the Jews! and they smote him with their hands.

Pilate therefore went forth again, and saith unto them, Behold, I bring him forth to you, that ye may know that I find no fault in him.

Then came Jesus forth, wearing the crown of thorns, and the purple robe. And Pilate saith unto them, Behold the man!

When the chief priests therefore and officers saw him, they cried out, saying, Crucify him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Take ye him, and crucify him: for I find no fault in him.

The Jews answered him, We have a law, and by our law he ought to die, because he made himself the Son of God.”

(John 19:1-7)

Originally posted by @thinkofone
In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God or the literal Son of God. I've yet to come across anyone who could make a cogent argument that Jesus claimed to be God, They don't seem to care what Jesus actually said or didn't say - not just about this, but in general. The following excerpt from what I posted in the OP se ...[text shortened]... een writing on this thread?

Any interest in the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

I’m firstly trying to understand you a little so that I have some perspective on your threads which I rarely contribute for this very reason. I ask asked you a few questions about what you believe, you don’t have to answer them but they are quite straightforward; you do not believe in the deity of Christ but ....

Do you believe there is a God at all?
In other words are you theist, atheist or agnostic?
I also asked if you are actually a follower of the words of Christ, I.e. you live them out yourself to the best of your ability?

I would be grateful if you could respond to these but I respect your right not to, as I’m sure you will respect my right to not persue engagement with you as previously.

Thank you.

Originally posted by @divegeester
I’m firstly trying to understand you a little so that I have some perspective on your threads which I rarely contribute for this very reason. I ask asked you a few questions about what you believe, you don’t have to answer them but they are quite straightforward; you do not believe in the deity of Christ but ....

Do you believe there is a God at all? ...[text shortened]... m sure you will respect my right to not persue engagement with you as previously.

Thank you.

Bump

Originally posted by @divegeester
I’m firstly trying to understand you a little so that I have some perspective on your threads which I rarely contribute for this very reason. I ask asked you a few questions about what you believe, you don’t have to answer them but they are quite straightforward; you do not believe in the deity of Christ but ....

Do you believe there is a God at all? ...[text shortened]... m sure you will respect my right to not persue engagement with you as previously.

Thank you.

Your questions are interesting in and of themselves. Do you think you can better understand someone by gaining understanding of their views or by asking them to label themselves? As for me, I think the former. Labels are not only superficial at best, they are often misleading,

I also asked if you are actually a follower of the words of Christ, I.e. you live them out yourself to the best of your ability?

If that's what you were attempting to ask, you fell well short of the mark.

The only questions I could find that came even close are the following:
<<You are a follower of his words rather than of him, is that correct?>>
<<Would you say you follow the teachings/words of Jesus but are not a theist?>>

How do either of the above equate to what you've claimed?