@kellyjay said
You most certainly are not here to address scripture, which is what you did not speak to, instead you attacked me personally, making claims that were not true as you did it. So doctrines and truth are not your strong suits so far.

What I have said about you is true. You believe in these types of 'Lord Lord' churches where they speak in tongues, do miracles, healing, casting out devils etc in the name of Jesus Christ. You said so yourself because you laughed at, and ridiculed me when I said that they are mostly scam artists. The only reason why you are denying it now is that I have pointed out to you that these are the types Jesus said that he does not know. [Matt 7] The reason Jesus does not know them is that they did not do good works and follow his commandments as Jesus explained. They believed wrongly, that using their Holy Spirit gifts to do miracles was good works... like you do.

The next problem with you and your posts is that it reeks of mouth worship. Nothing you say is from the sermons from Jesus Christ about good works and righteousness. You rather focus on the process by which a Christian can get eternal life. - the belief and faith, the Holy Spirit, the forgiveness, the death of Christ. You are a Paul Christian and you post nothing of what Jesus said about His commandments. All people get eternal life through Jesus Christ who was very clear about who gets it and who does not.

So your doctrine is not of Christ. Mine is.

@rajk999 said
What I have said about you is true. You believe in these types of 'Lord Lord' churches where they speak in tongues, do miracles, healing, casting out devils etc in the name of Jesus Christ. You said so yourself because you laughed at, and ridiculed me when I said that they are mostly scam artists. The only reason why you are denying it now is that I have pointed out to you ...[text shortened]... was very clear about who gets it and who does not.

So your doctrine is not of Christ. Mine is.

Like I said, you make yourself a judge.

Proclaiming things about me you don't know, and you have never seen me say. The reason Jesus didn't know those was not because of those works they claimed that they did, He did not deny they did them, but that He didn't know them. The works you are complaining about were done by Jesus and the Apostles, you think they were on the outs with God while doing them?

All the people who abide in Christ are His, if you deny Him He will deny you. Your doctrine has the Holy Spirit in those that deny Him, which doesn't line up with scripture yet it does with rajk999 doctrine.

When you spew "mouth worship" it is a made up word by you, the only thing that matters is if we are walking with the Lord, this can only be done by God's grace through faith, from there we do the works of God.

You can do the works of man any time you want, but only in Christ are we saved.
I don't preach miracles here, again, you make things up and act as if they are true. Your suggesting this is again as is your custom passing judgment on things not said, as if they were, you don't know the truth.

@kellyjay said
Like I said, you make yourself a judge.

Proclaiming things about me you don't know, and you have never seen me say. The reason Jesus didn't know those was not because of those works they claimed that they did, He did not deny they did them, but that He didn't know them. The works you are complaining about were done by Jesus and the Apostles, you think they were on the out ...[text shortened]... in as is your custom passing judgment on things not said, as if they were, you don't know the truth.

Rajk999's doctrine about who enters the Kingdom of God is this -

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

I made it all up. It's not in the bible.

Your God is evil. You worship a God fabricated by the church. A God that would eternally torment an innocent person.but would grant eternal life to hypocritical mouth worshipers.

My God rewards all the righteous with eternal life and all the evil with eternal destruction

@rajk999 said
Rajk999's doctrine about who enters the Kingdom of God is this -

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, ...[text shortened]... rs.

My God rewards all the righteous with eternal life and all the evil with eternal destruction

No one has ever said that wasn't in the Bible, everyone agrees that is in the Bible, your problem is that you seem to think that is the only verse in the Bible that talks about those that belong to God. Everyone I know agrees that is what Jesus is going to say to those that belong to Him, no dispute there! Now the rest of the Bible has other verses in it, they too are just as valid as what you quoted, and they are just as important.

Lets clear up one of your truly damning errors, there are no innocent people in the world, none of us are without sin, except Jesus Christ. You can call God a liar if you want, but Jesus was and is the only sinless one that has lived. All others have sinned, therefore there are no innocent people each of them has sinned.

Hebrews 4:15
For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin.

Romans 3:22-24 English Standard Version (ESV)
the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

Romans 5:11-13 English Standard Version (ESV)
More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned— for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.

1 John 1:7-9 English Standard Version (ESV)
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin. If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

It isn't God who is evil, but mankind, and only because of God's love for us do we have a hope of redemption, not because we are worthy of it, but because of God's love for us. You want to call God evil, I'd rethink your words, your placing man's righteousness above God's by saying that man is innocent and God is evil who condemns him without justification.

@kellyjay said
No one has ever said that wasn't in the Bible, everyone agrees that is in the Bible, your problem is that you seem to think that is the only verse in the Bible that talks about those that belong to God. Everyone I know agrees that is what Jesus is going to say to those that belong to Him, no dispute there! Now the rest of the Bible has other verses in it, they too are just a ...[text shortened]... s above God's by saying that man is innocent and God is evil who condemns him without justification.

YOUR GOD, The God fabricated by the church is evil. There is nothing to rethink. The God of Israel in which I believe, the Father of Jesus Christ is not evil. That God promised that the righteous will enter the Kingdom of God. he promised that the evil ones will be cast out and destroyed. That God is just. Yours is a crook and so are you.

The righteous are those who do good works
The evil are those who do not.
Its all there in Matt 25.
There is no respect of persons with God.

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God.
(Romans 2:7-11 KJV)

Your post is full of utter garbage. I will not spend any more time trying to educate a church fool who thinks that a man that lived for 25 yrs deserves an eternity [billions and billions of years] of torment.

@rajk999 said
YOUR GOD, The God fabricated by the church is evil. There is nothing to rethink. The God of Israel in which I believe, the Father of Jesus Christ is not evil. That God promised that the righteous will enter the Kingdom of God. he promised that the evil ones will be cast out and destroyed. That God is just. Yours is a crook and so are you.

The righteous are those who do ...[text shortened]... s that a man that lived for 25 yrs deserves an eternity [billions and billions of years] of torment.

If anyone thinks they can stand in front of God just on their works, they will die in their sins.

@kellyjay said
If anyone thinks they can stand in front of God just on their works, they will die in their sins.

Are you saying that Jesus is a liar? Here Jesus addresses thousands of people, telling them about the good works and righteousness that will get them into the Kingdom of God.

Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
(Matthew 5:3-10 KJV)

You are quoting a passage where Jesus addresses a handful of people [most of which are Pharisees] in the temple, who where going to stone a woman to death for adultery. Jesus tells them they are are sinners too and they have no privileged position compared to the woman.

You seem to think that Christians can escape their sin because they profess faith in Jesus Christ when others do not. You will find out that it is not going work that way

@rajk999 said
Are you saying that Jesus is a liar? Here Jesus addresses thousands of people, telling them about the good works and righteousness that will get them into the Kingdom of God.

[i]Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed ...[text shortened]... ofess faith in Jesus Christ when others do not. You will find out that it is not going work that way

No, I'm saying everything the Bible says is true, just not the parts you like. If He is not your redeemer, you are not redeemed. If He is not your savior, you are not saved. If He is not your Lord, you are still in rebellion to God. If God has not called you, and you have not answered, and God has not given you the Holy Spirit you don't belong to God.

The good works and righteous deeds will be there, all of it will be but in Christ.

Your taking what God does to the wicked by transforming them in sanctification in His redeeming work, and suggesting we can do these on our own without Christ to be worthy of Christ. What your suggesting is a lie!

1 Corinthians 1:29-31 English Standard Version (ESV)
so that no human being might boast in the presence of God. And because of him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, righteousness and sanctification and redemption, so that, as it is written, “Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

@kellyjay saidThe good works and righteous deeds will be there, all of it will be but in Christ.

Good works were impossible before Christ? Nonsense!
Can anyone do good works and live righteously ? Yes
Read Jesus's Sermon on the Mount.

Your church doctrine is garbage designed to make people feel worthless. Jesus Christ never did that,. he tried to lift people up rather than continuously put them down. You can take your church doctrine and stick it.

@rajk999 said
Good works were impossible before Christ? Nonsense!
Can anyone do good works and live righteously ? Yes
Read Jesus's Sermon on the Mount.

Your church doctrine is garbage designed to make people feel worthless. Jesus Christ never did that,. he tried to lift people up rather than continuously put them down. You can take your church doctrine and stick it.

We are sinners before a Holy God, if that escapes you not much can be said.

@rajk999 said
Good works were impossible before Christ? Nonsense!
Can anyone do good works and live righteously ? Yes
Read Jesus's Sermon on the Mount.

Your church doctrine is garbage designed to make people feel worthless. Jesus Christ never did that,. he tried to lift people up rather than continuously put them down. You can take your church doctrine and stick it.

Rajk. Could you let me know who here feels like you've lifted them up? Could you name one or is there anyone here who feels he has done this for you? Just asking!!!!!

@galveston75 said
Rajk. Could you let me know who here feels like you've lifted them up? Could you name one or is there anyone here who feels he has done this for you? Just asking!!!!!

If you are asking me what others feel about what I say then you are asking nonsense questions. Ask others what they feel, not me. Not that it matters.

Next I never said I lift up anyone. Did I?
I said JESUS LIFTS UP PEOPLE. Jesus did that by encouraging others to do good works and to live righteously and then they will be welcomed into the Kingdom of God.

The church is a destroyer of people. The church tells people
- they are hopeless sinners
- they are worthless
- the cannot do good works
- they are nothing

If your JW church is part of that nonsense then you will likewise account.

@kellyjay said
We are sinners before a Holy God, if that escapes you not much can be said.

Sinners who sin for 20 yrs will be tormented in burning flames for 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, years

That is an EVIL GOD.

A Holy God will allow the punishment to fit the crime.

Your doctrine is likewise sick and evil.
Your church is sick and evil
You are also sick and evil.

@rajk999 said
Sinners who sin for 20 yrs will be tormented in burning flames for 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000,000,000,000, PLUS 50,000,000, ...[text shortened]...
Your doctrine is likewise sick and evil.
Your church is sick and evil
You are also sick and evil.

No eternal punishment lasts forever.
Also it is not being worthy, not just the amount of sin, a single sin is enough for disqualifying. The judgment of works highlights the crimes.

@kellyjay said
No eternal punishment lasts forever.
Also it is not being worthy, not just the amount of sin, a single sin is enough for disqualifying. The judgment of works highlights the crimes.

Changing your tune now? Your big point was that if eternal life lasts forever, then so should eternal punishment.