Status quo?

Originally posted by galveston75
Ok lets just pick one thing of many issues. The Bible makes it extremely clear we are to love our neighbors as ourselves and we are not to kill anyone ever under most all circumstances. We are to remain neutral in the worlds politics and issues. So would a true Christian follow the command of ones governments to go and kill another human, possible anoth ...[text shortened]... eligion is Christian does not mean it is truly being Christian in actions or in it's teachings.

Just saying a religion is Christian does not mean it is truly being Christian in actions or in it's teachings.

I think this is precisely the rationale orthodox Christians use to dismiss Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormon's, etc.

Originally posted by galveston75
Status Quo?

I prefer the wild side of life...

Originally posted by divegeester
I prefer the wild side of life...

you mean a packet of crisps and a mars bar on a Sunday evening!

Originally posted by galveston75
It seems that a couple posters here in the spiritual forum have a belief that certain religions such as the newer JW's, Mormons, etc, cannot be accepted as a so called Christain religion because they have not meet some pre determend quota of time on this planet.

Can you support that claim? Can you quote anyone saying that they dismiss any of these groups because they are new? I certainly have never heard such a claim being made.

However, I have heard JWs saying that other groups are not Christian, and other groups saying the same about JWs (and the same for Mormons). I actually asked an Anglican priest why he said that JWs were not Christian (because it didn't make sense to me) and he said that it was because the JWs did not recognise him as Christian, going so far as to call Anglican priests 'the anti-Christ' so for him it was tit for tat.

So, do you accept anyone who claims to be Christian as Christian, and if not why not?

Originally posted by galveston75
It seems that a couple posters here in the spiritual forum have a belief that certain religions such as the newer JW's, Mormons, etc, cannot be accepted as a so called Christain religion because they have not meet some pre determend quota of time on this planet. And just because some bright and shinning light did not appear above their founders heads for ...[text shortened]... to qualify. All would have to be judged on their accomplisments, not their age.
Any thoughts?

Why in the world does there need to be another religion?
Isn't the whole point to get close to God, hasn't God made away to do that through
Jesus Christ? Denominations basically divide people they don't unite them, and
calling for a new religion seems like you are suggesting that the old one whatever
that happened to be in your sight wasn't doing the job. People in any denomination
can be lost it isn't the denomination or 'new religion' that saves people its Jesus
Christ.
Kelly

Originally posted by epiphinehas
[b]Just saying a religion is Christian does not mean it is truly being Christian in actions or in it's teachings.

I think this is precisely the rationale orthodox Christians use to dismiss Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormon's, etc.[/b]

Again if one is looking for a religion that follows the Bible and it's standards and does not follow any goverment of the world and only has their allegence to God then not many would qualify.
Jesus also said we are to be NO part of the world and that the world would HATE his followers just as he was hated.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Why in the world does there need to be another religion?
Isn't the whole point to get close to God, hasn't God made away to do that through
Jesus Christ? Denominations basically divide people they don't unite them, and
calling for a new religion seems like you are suggesting that the old one whatever
that happened to be in your sight wasn't doing the jo ...[text shortened]... t it isn't the denomination or 'new religion' that saves people its Jesus
Christ.
Kelly

Did Jesus not mention a "brotherhood" of his followers and that they would "All be in agreement"? Do the scriptures not mention " not to forsake the gathering of yourselves" for encouragement and for learning?
Did not Jesus organize congregations for this purpose and was watched over by the apostles and the elders?
So yes most organized religions do whatever they and their preachers want to do. My they even have bands that play soiritual rock n roll and dance and play bingo or have pot luck dinners, but as far a spiritual knowledge, they fair poorly.
But Jesus and the apostles formulated the congragtions with elders and to take that serious, which many here obviously don't.

Originally posted by galveston75
Again if one is looking for a religion that follows the Bible and it's standards and does not follow any goverment of the world and only has their allegence to God then not many would qualify.
Jesus also said we are to be NO part of the world and that the world would HATE his followers just as he was hated.

If the people of this website is representative of the people of the world, then I
seem to be hated more than you are. Your buddy, robbie has joined in with
hateful attacks on my character as well. Has he become part of the world?

Originally posted by galveston75
Jesus also said we are to be NO part of the world and that the world would HATE his followers just as he was hated.

It seems you are doomed to be a minority group. Odd then that you even ask why your denomination is not recognised by others. Its obvious. Either your correct, and you are doomed to be hated by others, or it is a self fulfilling prophesy ie you want to be hated by others so you make sure it is so.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Can you support that claim? Can you quote anyone saying that they dismiss any of these groups because they are new? I certainly have never heard such a claim being made.

RJH has said on several occasions that (according to him at least) JWs are not Christian.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Why in the world does there need to be another religion?
Isn't the whole point to get close to God, hasn't God made away to do that through
Jesus Christ? Denominations basically divide people they don't unite them, and
calling for a new religion seems like you are suggesting that the old one whatever
that happened to be in your sight wasn't doing the job.

This could actually become quite an interesting thread.

Why are there new religions or denominations? How do they get formed and what relevance do they have?

Looking at church history, there have been some major milestones, when "new revelation of Truth" appeared. The Reformation would probably count as one of these.

Then divisions appeared along doctrinal lines, e.g. Baptism, The Holy Spirit, Church Government, etc etc. Luther opened the flood gates!

Later other "new revelations" included e.g. the Book of Mormon - who is to say that the Angel Moroni didn't actually appear to Joseph Smith?

My point is that in EACH of these cases the founders believed most sincerely that they were either adding new insights or correcting past mistakes. I would go so far as to say that none of them intentionally started out to lead their followers down a slippery slope into hell.

This reminds me of the parable of the six blind men studying an elephant. One (holding the trunk) says an elephant is like a snake, another (holding the leg) says no, it is like a tree, another , etc you get the picture.

Maybe it is because God is impossible to put into a box - in fact, if you think you understand him, you have made an image, and an idol, and broken the first two commandments.

I have found the spats about the Trinity etc between JWs and others quite amusing. Maybe NEITHER of us understands the REAL picture fully, and the TRUTH, when we finally comprehend it, is totally different from both. Remember Paul's words that we are constantly looking "through a glass darkly"!

There is a very real possibility that ALL of us are partially correct, and partially wrong.

Raising the level of acceptance and loving concern for our neighbour higher seems to be the right thing, rather than drawing the lines ever closer and closer and tighter and tighter together, until we at last each sit on our own tiny little molehill!

Originally posted by CalJust
RJH has said on several occasions that (according to him at least) JWs are not Christian.

That wasn't in dispute. I was asking him to support his claim that the reasoning given was because they were a new denomination.

Originally posted by CalJust
Looking at church history, there have been some major milestones, when "new revelation of Truth" appeared. The Reformation would probably count as one of these.

Then divisions appeared along doctrinal lines, e.g. Baptism, The Holy Spirit, Church Government, etc etc. Luther opened the flood gates!

Later other "new revelations" included e.g. the Book of ...[text shortened]... ormon - who is to say that the Angel Moroni didn't actually appear to Joseph Smith?

Don't forget Mohammed!

Originally posted by CalJust
RJH has said on several occasions that (according to him at least) JWs are not Christian.

They are not Christian because they do not hold to sound doctrine, not because
they are new. I have no objection to new Christian groups starting up as long
as their doctrine does not depart from the faith passed on to the Christian saints. They should have a pastor who has been taught sound doctrine and
qualified to be pastor. Even though I can recognize sound doctrine, I would not
consider myself qualified to pastor a group of Christians.

Originally posted by RJHinds
They are not Christian because they do not hold to sound doctrine, not because
they are new. I have no objection to new Christian groups starting up as long
as their doctrine does not depart from the faith passed on to the Christian saints. They should have a pastor who has been taught sound doctrine and
qualified to be pastor. Even though I can recognize sound doctrine, I would not
consider myself qualified to pastor a group of Christians.

There are different doctrines amongst the followers of Christ. There is disagreement between different denominations and groups. You use the words "sound" and "qualified" but, in the context of differing perceptions and faiths, they are just subjective terms, regardless of how repeatedly you use them.