1. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 09:31
    Anybody believe that the big bang occured? I don't believe it. I believe that the big bang is still coming...

    2 Peter 3:10 - But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
  2. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    05 Sep '05 09:411 edit
    And there I was I thinking you were going to announce the loss of your virginity.

    By the way, did Peter really write the Petran epistles? I am curious. When did an uneducated fisherman find the time to learn Greek?
  3. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 09:48
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    And there I was I thinking you were going to announce the loss of your virginity.

    By the way, did Peter really write the Petran epistles? I am curious. When did an uneducated fisherman find the time to learn Greek?
    I suppose a more sophisticated question might be, "Did the Holy Spirit really write the Bible?"

    My answer is I believe so, yes.
  4. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    05 Sep '05 09:56
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    I suppose a more sophisticated question might be, "Did the Holy Spirit really write the Bible?"
    My primitive question is whether Peter wrote them. I gather you don't have an answer for that.
  5. Standard memberfrogstomp
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    05 Sep '05 10:01
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    And there I was I thinking you were going to announce the loss of your virginity.

    By the way, did Peter really write the Petran epistles? I am curious. When did an uneducated fisherman find the time to learn Greek?
    according to the "christians" the Holy Spirit also wrote that God told Joshua to kill all the canaanites and steal their land .

    Goats they be and goats they will remain.
    They worship a god that hates mankind.
  6. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 10:06
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    My primitive question is whether Peter wrote them. I gather you don't have an answer for that.
    My primitive answer would be yes, I believe that Peter wrote them whilest inspired by the Holy Spirit, as was the whole of the Bible written by people inspired by the Holy Spirit, which in essence makes the Holy Spirit the author of the entire Bible.
  7. Standard memberfrogstomp
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    05 Sep '05 10:07
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    My primitive question is whether Peter wrote them. I gather you don't have an answer for that.
    Pauline doctrine strikes again !
  8. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 10:21
    Originally posted by frogstomp
    according to the "christians" the Holy Spirit also wrote that God told Joshua to kill all the canaanites and steal their land .

    Goats they be and goats they will remain.
    They worship a god that hates mankind.
    according to the "christians" the Holy Spirit also wrote that God told Joshua to kill all the canaanites and steal their land .

    According to the same Bible God is also a Holy God and punishes sin.

    Goats they be and goats they will remain.
    They worship a god that hates mankind.


    That must be your god that hates mankind. The God that I serve does not tolerate sin. He punishes mankind to the 3rd and 4th generation that hates Him. But He also shows mercy to a thousand generations of those that love him and keep his commandments.

    As has been mentioned before you cannot separate God's love from his justice.
  9. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    05 Sep '05 10:25
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    My primitive answer would be yes, I believe that Peter wrote them whilest inspired by the Holy Spirit, as was the whole of the Bible written by people inspired by the Holy Spirit, which in essence makes the Holy Spirit the author of the entire Bible.
    Your answer is not very worldly.

    Here's a refutation of Petrine authorship of I and II Peter:

    http://www.geocities.com/paulntobin/authorpeter.html

    Note that ascribing authorship to a famous figure was common practice in the ancient world, not just among Christians.

    I'm happy to concede that the HS might have inspired these epistles; I just don't think the amanuensis had ever been fishing on Galilee.
  10. Donationbbarr
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    05 Sep '05 10:261 edit
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    [b]according to the "christians" the Holy Spirit also wrote that God told Joshua to kill all the canaanites and steal their land .

    According to the same Bible God is also a Holy God and punishes sin.

    Goats they be and goats they will remain.
    They worship a god that hates mankind.


    That must be your god ...[text shortened]... commandments.

    As has been mentioned before you cannot separate God's love from his justice.[/b]
    If your father stole my wallet, would it be just to punish you for this transgression? Would it be just to punish your grandchild for a crime committed by his great-grandfather? The answer here is 'no'. To deny this is just to arbitrarily redefine the term 'justice'. So, since you are merely arbitrarily redefining terms with well established patterns of usage, why should we take anything you have to say about justice (or love, for that matter) seriously?
  11. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 10:371 edit
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Your answer is not very worldly.

    Here's a refutation of Petrine authorship of I and II Peter:

    http://www.geocities.com/paulntobin/authorpeter.html

    Note that ascribing authorship to a famous figure was common practice in the ancient world, not just among Christians.

    I'm happy to concede that the HS might have inspired these epistles; I just don't think the amanuensis had ever been fishing on Galilee.
    Are we talking about the same Holy Spirit, or do you think the Holy Spirit can lead someone into lying about his own identity?
  12. Standard memberHalitose
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    05 Sep '05 10:38
    Originally posted by bbarr
    If your father stole my wallet, would it be just to punish you for this transgression? Would it be just to punish your grandchild for a crime committed by his great-grandfather? The answer here is 'no'. To deny this is just to arbitrarily redefine the term 'justice'. So, since you are merely arbitrarily redefining terms with well established patterns o ...[text shortened]... why should we take anything you have to say about justice (or love, for that matter) seriously?
    Do you have any reason to conclude that your or my definition of love and justice should be the same as God's?

    I agree with your wallet analogy though, I think this has more of a spiritual component than a physical.
  13. Donationbbarr
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    05 Sep '05 10:46
    Originally posted by Halitose
    Do you have any reason to conclude that your or my definition of love and justice should be the same as God's?

    I agree with your wallet analogy though, I think this has more of a spiritual component than a physical.
    I'm not talking about God's definition of "love" or "justice", I'm talking about dj2becker's definitions. He is the one making the claims here about what is loving and just.

    I'd be interested in hearing what the germane "spiritual component" here is. Are you saying we ought to take these claims concerning punishment metaphorically. If not, then how ought we take them? If so, then please analyze the metaphor.
  14. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    05 Sep '05 10:49
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    Are we talking about the same Holy Spirit?
    No, we are talking at cross purposes as usual, thanks to your usual tactic of answering a simple question with another question that has nothing to do with the first question.

    Perhaps the person who hid behind the name of Peter when writing those epistles had had a glimpse of the Transcendental Object at the End of Time! (http://frontwheeldrive.com/terence_mckenna.html)
  15. Standard memberdj2becker
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    05 Sep '05 10:59
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    No, we are talking at cross purposes as usual, thanks to your usual tactic of answering a simple question with another question that has nothing to do with the first question.

    Perhaps the person who hid behind the name of Peter when writing those epistles had had a glimpse of the Transcendental Object at the End of Time! (http://frontwheeldrive.com/terence_mckenna.html)
    I think my question is very relevant. I do not think the Holy Spirit would let Peter lie about his own identity. As he clearly states in 1 Peter 1:1
    "Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ..."
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