The Challenge

Originally posted by amannion
You have to be patient. The Earth took a while - hundreds of millions of years - and lots of space, to just get simple cells.
Ants took another couple of billion years of evolution.

With that math, we'd never be here. Oh, wait, that's right...

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
With that math, we'd never be here. Oh, wait, that's right...

Why?
The Earth is around 4.5 billion years old.
Allow a billion years for conditions to become possible for life to form, then allow 1/2 a billion years for life to form, that leaves you with 3 billion years. Allow 2 billion years for single celled life to become multicellular, that leaves you with about a billion years. A billion years to get ants - and us.
Plenty of time ...

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
easier for whom? the creator? or you, the scientist/mathematician or Vishy the illustrious?

Any of the above. You and Vishy claim that life has some special property that cannot be replicated in the lab. You do not make such claims about gold. Therefore, if you claim that my inability to make life in the lab proves that special ingredient, then I can equally claim that your inability to make gold in the lab proves that gold too has a special ingredient.

Originally posted by amannion
You have to be patient. The Earth took a while - hundreds of millions of years - and lots of space, to just get simple cells.
Ants took another couple of billion years of evolution.

But matter was bumbling along blindly, but the conscious intelligent scientists, can speed up the process because they know what sought of matter constitutes an ant, and they can produce a lightning bolt in their laboratory any time they want.

Originally posted by vishvahetu
But matter was bumbling along blindly, but the conscious intelligent scientists, can speed up the process because they know what sought of matter constitutes an ant, and they can produce a lightning bolt in their laboratory any time they want.

Well, the lightening bolt isn't necessary. All they need is the right chemicals in the right order. I will say it will take around 1,000 years before scientists are capable of producing your ant (although technically, it will still be a completely different species, but they might produce something that resembles an ant and still be alive). A lot less for something that is smaller and "living".

EDIT: Rather than a completely different species, because it will be artificial, you could argue it isn't any species at all, because it wouldn't have evolved from life forms that we have already defined as a biological classification that exists already.

Originally posted by vishvahetu
But matter was bumbling along blindly, but the conscious intelligent scientists, can speed up the process because they know what sought of matter constitutes an ant, and they can produce a lightning bolt in their laboratory any time they want.

Conscious intelligent scientists are good, but nothing we know of beats time, and several billion years is essentially an unimaginable time period. We use these numbers - millions and billions - but don't really, can't really, appreciate their real meaning.
Knowing something is one thing; actually doing something is completely different.
I know the mechanics of a really good football game, but can I play football? Not terribly well.

And I might add, we don't even really know. We still don't understand how life started - scientifically that is. So, to suggest we should create it in a lab to prove something is a little ludicrous.
To suggest that because we can't there must be something mysterious and supernatural about the process is just as ludicrous.

Originally posted by amannion
Conscious intelligent scientists are good, but nothing we know of beats time, and several billion years is essentially an unimaginable time period. We use these numbers - millions and billions - but don't really, can't really, appreciate their real meaning.
Knowing something is one thing; actually doing something is completely different.
I know the mechan ...[text shortened]... there must be something mysterious and supernatural about the process is just as ludicrous.

So given enough time, the bumbling dead matter can come alive, and then produce millions of complete complex life forms...huuum, I dont think so!

Originally posted by vishvahetu
Ok, so all the dishonest atheistic scientists, say that life comes from matter, so if life comes from matter, so go and fetch some matter....now create some life.

If all the matter around us is creating life every day by itself, then a conscious scientist should be able to create life in their labratory.

I will make it very easy, go and create a lit ...[text shortened]... m the big big scientist.

So Iam waiting, I demand to see that little tiny ant created by you.

There is no Life, Truth, Intelligence, nor Substance in matter..

All ~is~ INFINITE Mind, and it's Infinite manifestation, for God IS all in all...

Spirit ~is~ Immortal Truth, matter, mortal error..

Spirit ~is~ the ~real~ and Eternal, matter is the UNreal and ~temporal~....

Spirit ~is~ GOD, and ~man~ (either gender) IS ~HIS~ Image and LikeNESS.

YouTube

Therefore man IS NOT ~material~ he ~is~ SPIRITUAL! period

Originally posted by amannion
Why?
The Earth is around 4.5 billion years old.
Allow a billion years for conditions to become possible for life to form, then allow 1/2 a billion years for life to form, that leaves you with 3 billion years. Allow 2 billion years for single celled life to become multicellular, that leaves you with about a billion years. A billion years to get ants - and us.
Plenty of time ...

i read a rather interesting quotation recently, i share it with you,

'simple bacteria can divide about every twenty minutes and have many hundreds of different proteins, each containing twenty types of amino acids arranged in chains that might be several hundred long. For bacteria to evolve by beneficial mutations one at a time would take much much longer than three or four billion years, the time that many scientists believe life has existed upon the earth'.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
i read a rather interesting quotation recently, i share it with you,

'simple bacteria can divide about every twenty minutes and have many hundreds of different proteins, each containing twenty types of amino acids arranged in chains that might be several hundred long. For bacteria to evolve by beneficial mutations one at a time would take much m ...[text shortened]... or four billion years, the time that many scientists believe life has existed upon the earth'.

That could be true and is certainly a problem for the origin of life, however evolution is cumulative. Mutations build on top of mutations - giving a sort of bootstrap effect.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
i read a rather interesting quotation recently, i share it with you,

'simple bacteria can divide about every twenty minutes and have many hundreds of different proteins, each containing twenty types of amino acids arranged in chains that might be several hundred long. For bacteria to evolve by beneficial mutations one at a time would take much m ...[text shortened]... or four billion years, the time that many scientists believe life has existed upon the earth'.

How can bacteria have any form of reality, any truth to it, if God created all that was GOOD, therefore not man's inventions?

Are we to believe simply due to the fact that mankind has been under it's subtle influence (it's lie) for 6,000 yrs. any concepts of dis-eases or mal-functions have any factual premises?

I have WAY more faith in ALL of you! period =]

Originally posted by tacoandlettuce
How can bacteria have any form of reality, any truth to it, if God created all that was GOOD, therefore not man's inventions?

What world do you live in? Bizzaroland?

Originally posted by tacoandlettuce
How can bacteria have any form of reality, any truth to it, if God created all that was GOOD, therefore not man's inventions?

mmm, bacteria is real and is used to perform many useful functions, for example, consider the life of a plant, eventually it breaks down and bacteria in the soil turns the decomposing matter into nitrogen which plants can then use. Its not a matter of faith, it just happens and is rather wonderful in my measly opinion.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
mmm, bacteria is real and is used to perform many useful functions, for example, consider the life of a plant, eventually it breaks down and bacteria in the soil turns the decomposing matter into nitrogen which plants can then use. Its not a matter of faith, it just happens and is rather wonderful in my measly opinion.

However, what ~you just stated~ was an "invented concept that man manifested as real to them" when they sought out such their understanding under a ~material VIEW~, thereFORE ~losing SIGHT~ of God's creation from the very beginning while they come from the standpoint (this lie that wars the reality, opposed from the dream we have made Life seem to be) of Adam's fall to his true estate of being (The Image and LikeNESS of INFINITE INTELLIGENCE, that being God)..