The cross - Just a carpenters tool?

Originally posted by RJHinds
I repeat from your link:

[b]The Greeks apparently used the word 'stauros' to represent a wide range of wooden structures used for executions, but Jehovah's Witnesses and a few others interpret the word to mean Jesus was executed on a post without a patibulum.

Your viewpoint is in the minority and there is no proof it is right. Logic and reason indicate it was a cross composed of a post and a patibulum.[/b]

ITS A PAGAN SYMBOL! you have provided no logic and no reasons other than some stupid assertion that there wasn't enough room for a sign.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Except that it's pretty difficult to have a crucifixion without a cross.

why do you say that, have you studied the physics and biology behind it?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
ITS A PAGAN SYMBOL! you have provided no logic and no reasons other than some stupid assertion that there wasn't enough room for a sign.

Did you forget that the Roman pagans crucified Christ? 😏

P.S. More proof the crucifixion was on a cross rather than just an upright stake:

http://www.bible.ca/d-history-archeology-crucifixion-cross.htm

http://www.frontline-apologetics.com/JW_Cross_Stake_Problem.html

To robbie:

Psalm 22 is generally regarded as a prophecy in song of Christ's crucifixion becaus Jesus speaks the beginning verse while being crucified.


My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?
Far from my deliverance are the words of my groaning.
O my God, I cry by day, but You do not answer;
And by night, but I have no rest.
Yet You are holy,
O You who are enthroned upon the praises of Israel.
In You our fathers trusted;
They trusted and You delivered them.
To You they cried out and were delivered;
In You they trusted and were not disappointed.

But I am a worm and not a man,
A reproach of men and despised by the people.
All who see me sneer at me;
They separate with the lip, they wag the head, saying,
“Commit yourself to the Lord; let Him deliver him;
Let Him rescue him, because He delights in him.”

Yet You are He who brought me forth from the womb;
You made me trust when upon my mother’s breasts.
Upon You I was cast from birth;
You have been my God from my mother’s womb.

Be not far from me, for trouble is near;
For there is none to help.
Many bulls have surrounded me;
Strong bulls of Bashan have encircled me.
They open wide their mouth at me,
As a ravening and a roaring lion.
I am poured out like water,
And all my bones are out of joint;
My heart is like wax;
It is melted within me.
My strength is dried up like a potsherd,
And my tongue cleaves to my jaws;
And You lay me in the dust of death.
For dogs have surrounded me;
A band of evildoers has encompassed me;
They pierced my hands and my feet.
I can count all my bones.
They look, they stare at me;
They divide my garments among them,
And for my clothing they cast lots.

Psalm22:1-18 NASB)

What is meant by, "And all my bones are out of joint; I can count all my bones." ?? Could he see his bones were out of joint and count them?

Originally posted by RJHinds
Did you forget that the Roman pagans crucified Christ? 😏

P.S. More proof the crucifixion was on a cross rather than just an upright stake:

http://www.bible.ca/d-history-archeology-crucifixion-cross.htm

http://www.frontline-apologetics.com/JW_Cross_Stake_Problem.html

Do you believe there are pieces of the cross under the obelisk in St Peter's Square?

Originally posted by divegeester
Do you believe there are pieces of the cross under the obelisk in St Peter's Square?

You must mean the cross Peter is supposed to have been crucified on, right? I am ignorant of all the details of that incident and would not feel confident to even make a guess.

Originally posted by JS357
Could you and others who profess to know the NT respond on this?

He doesn't know the NT. He knows the JW version of the NT, with all its "adding unto" and "taking away" warned about in Revelation 22.

Originally posted by VoidSpirit
why do you say that, have you studied the physics and biology behind it?

why add mountains of confusion to the issue?

can you stop for a moment and just tell me what "crux" means?

EDIT: And I don't mean "The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe", either. I mean, Crux is the Latin for what word in English?

Originally posted by RJHinds
To robbie:

Psalm 22 is generally regarded as a prophecy in song of Christ's crucifixion becaus Jesus speaks the beginning verse while being crucified.


[b]My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?
Far from my deliverance are the words of my groaning.
O my God, I cry by day, but You do not answer;
And by night, but I have no rest.
Yet You are ...[text shortened]... I can count all my bones." ?? Could he see his bones were out of joint and count them?[/b][/b]

As I understand it, it is a simple prophecy that those Romans crucifying Christ would not break his legs, as they typically did at the last hour to most people being crucified in order to accelerate death.

Originally posted by Suzianne
why add mountains of confusion to the issue?

can you stop for a moment and just tell me what "crux" means?

EDIT: And I don't mean "The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe", either. I mean, Crux is the Latin for what word in English?

crux in latin or greek? greek doesn't have that word.

Originally posted by Suzianne
why add mountains of confusion to the issue?

can you stop for a moment and just tell me what "crux" means?

EDIT: And I don't mean "The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe", either. I mean, Crux is the Latin for what word in English?

From Wikipedia:

Ancient Greek has two verbs for crucify: ana-stauro, from stauros, "stake", and apo-tumpanizo "crucify on a plank." [4] together with anaskolopizo ; "impale"😉. In earlier pre-Roman Greek texts anastauro usually means "impale."[5][6][7] The word xylon "piece of wood" was also used, but for a gallows, not a stake, as in the Aristophanes comedy The Frogs; "if you stumble, at least you'll hang from a respectable tree."[8]
The Latin term crux may mean a gallows[9][10] or a stake.[11]

Originally posted by VoidSpirit
crux in latin or greek? greek doesn't have that word.

Tell me then why would you ask me questions and then evade mine?

I asked the question twice in my post. The second time to help avoid your evasion attempts.

Originally posted by twhitehead
From Wikipedia:

Ancient Greek has two verbs for crucify: ana-stauro, from stauros, "stake", and apo-tumpanizo "crucify on a plank." [4] together with anaskolopizo ; "impale"😉. In earlier pre-Roman Greek texts anastauro usually means "impale."[5][6][7] The word xylon "piece of wood" was also used, but for a gallows, not a stake, as in the Aristoph ...[text shortened]... le tree."[8]
The Latin term crux may mean a gallows[9][10] or a stake.[11]

Wrong again.

Crux is Latin for the English word 'cross'. Evade this simple fact all you like.

You can NOT "crucify" without a "crux". Sorry.

Originally posted by JS357

However, the important thing is that Jesus was crucified as an atonement sacrifice for all our sins.

That seems to be the important thing about the story, but as I have said elsewhere, I was taught that the atonement sacrifice of Christ was for Original Sin only, not for "all our sins." This seems of greater importance than the shape of the w ...[text shortened]... st people even being born?

Could you and others who profess to know the NT respond on this?

John 3:16 covers everlasting life, In Romans and Hebrews sins are covered as all sins.
In the Old Testament before Christ was born, their sins were forgiven by faith looking forward to the promise of a Savior. In the New Testament they are forgiven looking back at the sacrifice.
Heb 10:12-14
But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God, 13 from that time waiting till His enemies are made His footstool. 14 For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified.
NKJV

Rom 4:16-19
Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, "I have made you a father of many nations"😉 in the presence of Him whom he believed — God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did; 18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, "So shall your descendants be."
NKJV

Rom 4:20-22
He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. 22 And therefore "it was accounted to him for righteousness."
NKJV

Rom 4:23-25
Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.
NKJV

Originally posted by Suzianne
Tell me then why would you ask me questions and then evade mine?

I asked the question twice in my post. The second time to help avoid your evasion attempts.

i'm trying to find the relevance of your question. the bible doesn't say jesus was crucified, it says jesus was staked. the stake could be an 'X' , it could be a 'T' ,it could be a 'I' beam or a tree, even a wall.

so what is the relevance of asking the meaning of a latin and/or english word that does not appear in the bible?