The Inward Journey

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I think the Star Trek type journeys into the depths of space will not be of any practical significance unless the humans have a full knowledge and control of their minds/brains.

Are you talking about the kind of "knowledge and control" of the mind/brain that you and Dasa advocate here?

Originally posted by rwingett
If this "inward" journey does not manifest itself in positive change in the "external" world, then it is of little practical value.

We have to first start on the imward journey and then only the benefits to mankind,if any, will be apparent. The neuroscientific approach must have yielded some benefit already,although only the scientists can tell.

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Is discovering water in one of the moons of Saturn more of immediate relevance or study of human brain/mind?

I ask you again, are you claiming that governments have not invested in the study of human brain/mind? What evidence do you have that we have invested in discovering water in one of the moons of Saturn but not in the study of human brain/mind?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
We have to first start on the imward journey and then only the benefits to mankind,if any, will be apparent. The neuroscientific approach must have yielded some benefit already,although only the scientists can tell.

If you admit you don't know what benefit the neuroscientific approach has yielded and are still talking about what an American celebrity said about science more than 40 years ago, and can only mention the science of space travel in a trivializing way for your rhetorical purposes, isn't your stated 'concern' rather lacking in substance?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Not on the scale of space programmes,surely. And while there could be some govt. investment in Neuroscience studies,the investments in studies of Meditation may be negligible. Is discovering water in one of the moons of Saturn more of immediate relevance or study of human brain/mind? I think the Star Trek type journeys into the depths of space will not be ...[text shortened]... ractical significance unless the humans have a full knowledge and control of their minds/brains.

I have a number of times tried to communicate with people about various concepts relating to far eastern ideas about the mind. But for some reason I find we fail to communicate. I for one, would not want my tax dollars spent on something until I can understand at least the basics of what it is about and what the benefits will be.

Originally posted by rwingett
If this "inward" journey does not manifest itself in positive change in the "external" world, then it is of little practical value.

First of all the inward journey has nothing to do with false religion and meditation.

This cheating type of meditation that most get involved with is just wasted time.........staring at the nose and thinking of thinking of nothing.

The inward journey is explained in the Vedas as "Sankirtana" along with "Vaisnava devotion Service" and study of the "Vaisnava conclusion explained in the sastras".

So engaging in those three things Sankirtana, devotional service and study of Vaisnava conclusions ..... there will be now no need to speculate or fabricate your own spirituality but just simply follow the process given by the Vedic authority.

All these together will culminate in the most effective process for the inward journey.

Persons who engage in this method of spiritual rejuvenation shall effect a change that is at once noticeable.

If a million persons do it then the effective change will be even more noticeable.

Word of warning....

The Vedas that you will find on-line will be divided into impersonal and personal and the impersonal is not the authoritative method and should be avoided completely. *there is a complete explanation for this but "that's another lengthy post"

Trying to understand true spiritual life by becoming an (armchair spiritualist) and going to wiki all the time shall only confuse and mislead and everyone will definitely without doubt come to a false conclusion.

Why do we need to spend any $ on inner space travel? What for? incense, relaxataion tapes and a cushion?

All those things can be foud cheaply or even in the dumptser across the road 🙂

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I have read that Time magazine asked Charles Lindbergh,the famous aviator,his views regarding the future of space exploration which had then just got under way, both by USA and the USSR. He replied that he was confident that Man will land on Moon and will also travel to Mars in the foreseable future. But,the more important journey,according to him was not ...[text shortened]... of the inward journey? iii) what are the benefits to us as a race of the inward journey,if any?

What are your views reg.i) whether our inward journey is more important than the the space exploration? And more resources need to be diverted towards the inward journey? ii) which is the more promising of the two directions of the inward journey? iii) what are the benefits to us as a race of the inward journey,if any?

More important? Over any person's lifetime, the outward journey begins at one finite point and ends at another. Over that lifetime, the inner journey begins at zero and ends at infinity. The only resource needed is the ability to meet one's personal commitment to the inward journey, which I suppose pragmatically, means time. A society should value its citizens having time to commit to the inward journey. But specific programs, etc. should be avoided, as it will be politicized.
More promising of the two inward? I see neuroscience as an outward journey.
Benefit to the human race of the inward journey? The potential for universal compassion; expansion of the scope of the term "my kind."

Originally posted by Dasa
So engaging in those three things Sankirtana, devotional service and study of Vaisnava conclusions ..... there will be now no need to speculate or fabricate your own spirituality but just simply follow the process given by the Vedic authority.

Yes, your claim that you personally choose to engage in 'Sankirtana', 'devotional service' and 'the study of Vaisnava conclusions' is something we assume is an honest claim on your part, of course. But virtually nobody here acknowledges or chooses to submit to what you call "Vedic authority", so all your assertions about what is and isn't "speculation" or "fabrication" are almost entirely in vain and do not "effect a change that is at once noticeable", at least not in this community. Same goes for what you personally perceive to be, and assert about, "cheating", "falsity", "wasted time" etc. etc.

Originally posted by FMF
Are you talking about the kind of "knowledge and control" of the mind/brain that you and Dasa advocate here?

I am talking about the " self-knowledge and control of one's own mind ". This is the spiritual aim of the inward journey. As pointed out by Karoly and JS 357, it requires very little resources except some time alone with oneself and a desire to know. (Of course large amounts of time,money,talent is still required for the neuroscientific approach) What is the use,if we humans travel to outer space,still full of our foibles and failings,as on earth ? What is the use of the SETI project,if we humans here on earth are yet to know /understand each other fully. What is the immediate practical relevance of the discovery of water on one of the moons of Saturn, if a large part of humanity here on earth is not sure of getting clean drinking water ?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I am talking about the " self-knowledge and control of one's own mind ". This is the spiritual aim of the inward journey. As pointed out by Karoly and JS 357, it requires very little resources except some time alone with oneself and a desire to know. (Of course large amounts of time,money,talent is still required for the neuroscientific approach) What is ...[text shortened]... urn, if a large part of humanity here on earth is not sure of getting clean drinking water ?

the problem with SETI is that they are looking in the wrong "place"

Originally posted by karoly aczel
the problem with SETI is that they are looking in the wrong "place"

Exactly!

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I am talking about the " self-knowledge and control of one's own mind ". This is the spiritual aim of the inward journey. As pointed out by Karoly and JS 357, it requires very little resources except some time alone with oneself and a desire to know. (Of course large amounts of time,money,talent is still required for the neuroscientific approach) What is ...[text shortened]... urn, if a large part of humanity here on earth is not sure of getting clean drinking water ?

I already have a pretty good self-knowledge and control of my own mind. Do you? As you say, it requires very little resources except some time alone with oneself and a desire to know (although I would add a few other things in the quest for comprehension of the spiritual dimension). Why would you advocate taking space exploration expenditure and allocating it to something you concede takes "very little resources"?

I notice you are sidestepping my questions to you. And now you have introduced something new: 'clean drinking water'. Your OP sought to set up a choice - a false dilemma, I would say - between space exploration and stuff like neuroscience. And now you introduce the problem of obtaining clean drinking water, which is neither connected to space exploration, nor connected to neuroscience or studies on meditation. Indeed, it is largely a political issue.

Originally posted by FMF
Yes, your claim that you personally choose to engage in 'Sankirtana', 'devotional service' and 'the study of Vaisnava conclusions' is something we assume is an honest claim on your part, of course. But virtually nobody here acknowledges or chooses to submit to what you call "Vedic authority", so all your assertions about what is and isn't "speculation" or "fabri ive to be, and assert about, "cheating", "falsity", "wasted time" etc. etc.

Of course they don't acknowledge true spirituality because they will firstly be instructed to stop killing by the authority.........but they don't want to stop killing.

Therefore their rejection is simply whimsical rejection because they are dishonest.

Dishonest because they do not reject from the platform of knowledge but from the platform of ignorance.

Rejecting on this platform is dishonest because it is baseless..

I have been over this before but because you are a rascal you forget very easy.

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
This is the spiritual aim of the inward journey [which..] requires very little resources except some time alone with oneself and a desire to know. (Of course large amounts of time,money,talent is still required for the neuroscientific approach

What evidence do you have that not enough resources have been allocated to the "neuroscientific approach"? What level of funding do you propose? You mention the alleged need for "large amounts" of money. Be specific, please. How should the allocation of government investment for "the spiritual aim of the inward journey" measure up against the allocation for securing clean drinking water for all or for space exploration?