Originally posted by yoctobyte Dude, I said it before I will say it again. [b]You do not know me, you don't know what I believe or how I believe it. Please do not lump me in with your view of doctrinal differences... I have no party line to tow.
I am ignoring nothing, I answered your question in so far as I have an answer, I have nothing more to ad. For me, what await ...[text shortened]... Now would you answer my question that I asked?
What stream of Christianity are you a part of?[/b]
What stream of Christianity I am part of is totally irrelevant to this thread.
You did not answer the question properly... that is give a Biblical answer to the question under consideration. All you give is what you believe or want to believe.
Towing the party line means to hold on to a doctrine despite the fact that the Bible does not support it. Clearly you are doing that here.
Originally posted by SwissGambit You sound strangely excited by that. Sicko. 😕
On the contrary I assure you. I am not very good at articulating my thoughts in the way I would like and sonship nailed it for what I was trying to say. I would not want anybody to endure the kind of torment I am trying to describe... not even my worst enemy. I would not want that for anyone.
Originally posted by FMF Billions upon billions of innocent people, past, present, future, and ~ we are assured ~forever, being tortured by fire as a punishment, suffering in excruciating agony ~ all for a thought crime.
Has the human imagination ever been to a darker place than this?
I have. I came up with a god who would alter the past so you existed in torment in eternity past, as well as the usual eternity future.
Kidding aside, the whole thing sounds like a children's one-up game.
"My God kills you if you rebel against him!"
"Oh yeah?! Well, my God kills you and torments your soul!"
The strange part is when all these grown-ups play it, and it goes on for more than about 5 minutes without anyone realizing how ridiculous the whole thing is.
Originally posted by Rajk999 What stream of Christianity I am part of is totally irrelevant to this thread.
You did not answer the question properly... that is give a Biblical answer to the question under consideration. All you give is what you believe or want to believe.
Towing the party line means to hold on to a doctrine despite the fact that the Bible does not support it. Clearly you are doing that here.
Originally posted by robbie carrobie I would like to ask those who advocate the idea of 'torment' as separation from God whether the torment is 'conscious torment'.
I am not an advocate of any torment or of separation from God. To answer your question, for me it was very 'conscious torment'. By advocate, I mean as one who would promote the idea as a means to some end.
Originally posted by yoctobyte I am not an advocate of any torment or of separation from God. To answer your question, for me it was very 'conscious torment'. By advocate, I mean as one who would promote the idea as a means to some end.
Hope that answers your question.
I am not asking you personally how separation from God was tormenting, i am asking about those who are in the lake of fire, whether its a conscious 'torment' or not ?
Originally posted by robbie carrobie I am not asking you personally how separation from God was tormenting, i am asking about those who are in the lake of fire, whether its a conscious 'torment' or not ?
Couldn't tell you, never been there as far as I know. My understanding of it goes no farther actually than what is written in the bible. It is not a topic I have really studied, there are lot's of opinions on it however.
What do you believe? For those in the lake of fire, is it a conscious 'torment' or not?
Originally posted by yoctobyte Couldn't tell you, never been there as far as I know. My understanding of it goes no farther actually than what is written in the bible. It is not a topic I have really studied, there are lot's of opinions on it however.
What do you believe? For those in the lake of fire, is it a conscious 'torment' or not?
no it cannot be, the lake of fire means the second death Rev 20:14, that is annihilation without the prospect of a resurrection. Dead are not conscious, the book of Ecclesiastes says as much.
Originally posted by robbie carrobie no it cannot be, the lake of fire means the second death Rev 20:14, that is annihilation without the prospect of a resurrection. Dead are not conscious, the book of Ecclesiastes says as much.
Somewhere over the years I learned that burnings at the stake were justified by the idea that eternal torment was to follow and that these torments could righteously be started early. This was part of the justification for use of the threat of burning to scare many a heretic into recanting. Of course if you don't follow through with this kind of threat, it loses its power. This rationale, that they are headed to the eternal lake of fire anyway, so God approves starting early, eased the pangs of human empathy that active participants might have had. Besides, such events were popular spectacles.
The Lake Of Fire
08 Apr '14 18:35
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