Originally posted by @rajk999What I find intriguing about Suzianne in the matter of the supposed torture by burning of billions and billions of people for eternity for their lack of belief (an ideology propagated by several Christians here) is how she says the presence or absence of such a grotesque characteristic in god is "not significant" in terms of the nature of that god.
Sounds like it
To me a torturer god and a god who doesn't torture are two different god figures, just as a parent who burnt his children with cigarettes to discipline them is different from a parent who'd never dream of doing such a thing.
I reckon her repeated out-of-hand dismissal of this fundamental nature-of-god issue is caused by a desire to gainsay people for-the-sake-of-it rooted in her unprincipled forum partisanship rather than a measured analysis of the implications of the torturer god ideology. It's a pity. I imagine if she were a mainstream Muslim and sonship was a member of ISIS, she wouldn't speak out against his version of their supposedly shared religion when criticized by a non-Muslim.
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeIt was in all the papers, you missed it? 🙂
Was unaware you knew all the atheists here. Was there a convention I missed?
Originally posted by @fmfThey have the clique mentality. Its all about support for their friends, rather than a having a truthful and honest discssion. Several others are infected by this diseasse .. josephw, lennunammi, sonship are just a few.
What I find intriguing about Suzianne in the matter of the supposed torture by burning of billions and billions of people for eternity for their lack of belief (an ideology propagated by several Christians here) is how she says the presence or absence of such a grotesque characteristic in god is "not significant" in terms of the nature of that god.
To me a ...[text shortened]... eak out against his version of their supposedly shared religion when criticized by a non-Muslim.
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @rajk999... sigh
They have the clique mentality. Its all about support for their friends, rather than a having a truthful and honest discssion. Several others are infected by this diseasse .. josephw, lennunammi, sonship are just a few.
I find that you have 'the clique mentality. Its all about support for your friends, rather than a having a truthful and honest discussion'. If there is something that you disagree Rajk999 with in regards to what I have said here, please state it so that it can be discussed rather that having a sideline fluffing your feathers like a peacock with folks that don't even believe what you do against those that do.
Originally posted by @leunammiYou are funny, either that or you have not been reading what I write. You for example dont believe anything like me.
... sigh
I find that you have 'the clique mentality. Its all about support for your friends, rather than a having a truthful and honest discussion'. If there is something that you disagree Rajk999 with in regards to what I have said here, please state it so that it can be discussed rather that having a sideline fluffing your feathers like a peacock with folks that don't even believe what you do against those that do.
For starters. I believe in the teachings Jesus Christ first while everyone else comes a distant second.
What do you believe in?
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @rajk999Hmmm. don't know if that is totally true. For instance, do you believe...
You are funny, either that or you have not been reading what I write. You for example dont believe anything like me.
John 3:13-18New King James Version (NKJV)
13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. 18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
I do, don't you?
Originally posted by @leunammiLike i said you have not been reading what I write. I have had discussions with several Christians on that very passage.
Hmmm. don't know if that is totally true. For instance, do you believe...
John 3:13-18New King James Version (NKJV)
13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes i ...[text shortened]... dy, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
I do, don't you?
You believe that the way that Jesus did not intend for you to beleive it.
In a nutshell there are two kinds of belief:
1. Belief with your mouth - just saying you believe in Christ- mouth worship
2. There is belief from the heart - obeying Christ, following the commandments, doing good works
Mouth worship is condemned all over the Bible and is an insult to God.
Let me know if you need me to prove that.
Belief 1 leads to eternal damnation
Belief 2 leads to eternal life.
Therefore I believe that passage means that one must engage in belief 2 in order to get eternal life.
And this is consistent with the teachings of Chrsit.
Jesus said good works = eternal life
Did you read Matt 25?
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @rajk999
Like i said you have not been reading what I write. I have had discussions with several Christians on that very passage.
You believe that the way that Jesus did not intend for you to beleive it.
In a nutshell there are two kinds of belief:
1. Belief with your mouth - just saying you believe in Christ- mouth worship
2. There is belief from the hea ...[text shortened]... t with the teachings of Chrsit.
Jesus said good works = eternal life
Did you read Matt 25?
You believe that the way that Jesus did not intend for you to beleive it.
You assume and make yourself look foolish, you don't know what my understanding is or how I believe on this scripture as I have never stated it nor been asked.
You see Rajk999, the problem is, you do this with a lot of people from what I have seen. You have your understanding and tell others what they believe (or don't believe), not all I think but many. You have it in such a way in your head that you cannot see anything else, and if you can see something else, it is wrong.
Like I said before, you don't know what people that call themselves Christians do away from this forum, you assume you know but you don't. It would not surprise me one bit, if many here followed Jesus commands more than you but don't talk about it (left hand right hand).
Until you actually have a honest conversation about what someone actually believes, you never will know about another and probably would not believe it anyhow. Additionally, it takes a little transparency, direct personal questions at times. But because that is something you have difficulty with, there is an impasse. So the point is moot.
Belief with your mouth, belief with your heart, what is that?
Do you realize that in Revelation, they overcome? by what? Mouth Worship (your phrase). The word of their testimony is 'mouth worship' to God, there is power in that.
Revelation 12:11 New King James Version (NKJV)
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.
Words and action! Does any of this resonate at all with you, or am I in your mind just another loser with nothing to say?
Originally posted by @leunammi to somebody else on a debate & discussion forum where people discuss what they believe and what their understanding is...Do you think withholding this information - and then referring to how people don't know what you haven't told them - makes you an interesting conversationalist?
...you don't know what my understanding is or how I believe on this scripture as I have never stated it nor been asked.
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @fmfNever said I was an interesting conversationalist, nor have I implied it.
Do you think withholding this information - and then referring to how people don't know what you haven't told them - makes you an interesting conversationalist?
Do you think the manner in which you ask some of the questions that you do makes you an interesting conversationalist?
I will put it right out there, I don't!
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @leunammiI am happy with the way I contribute to this community and stand by everything I've ever said or asked. If you don't find it interesting, that's fine by me.
Do you think the manner in which you ask some of the questions that you do makes you an interesting conversationalist?
20 Jul 17
Originally posted by @leunammiSo what is your purpose then when you flit into ongoing conversations, withhold information about your beliefs and opinions about the topic in hand, and then refer to how people don't know what you haven't told them? On a debate and discussion forum, what is your purpose in doing something like that?
I will put it right out there, I don't!