Originally posted by karoly aczel
The majority of the thread was not about the subject of the thread.
Its a silly title anyway since 'God' and'origon' are the same thing except for the spelling.

Silly? Now you've gone and hurt my feelings. 😕

Originally posted by knightmeister
I know of no rule that says that threads must always finish with the same issue as they start with? Many threads go in many different directions. I'm wondering why you failed to pick up on ToO's complete inability to answer in any way the discrepancy between Matt 6:9 and his interpretation of John 8:32?

As far as I can see all he did was to cut and ...[text shortened]... er you say about our exchanges only one of us was willing to put the whole thing to the test.

How many times did ToO ask you to read his OP?
look, probably I shouldn't be scoring this thread because I am not as well versed in the bible as you and ToO, but please...page after page of the same rubbish.
Maybe the score should've been -1/-1?

Originally posted by josephw
Silly? Now you've gone and hurt my feelings. 😕

you'll get over it-happens to me all the time😉

Originally posted by karoly aczel
you'll get over it-happens to me all the time😉

🙂

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Wow. You resurrected this after quite some time passed.

[b]The leap that says they both must have a beginning is also
a leap to defend a 'deeply vested interest in protecting their belief system...I'm not sure why you feel the need to tell me, that when I tell you the God I believe
in is eternal and the creator as part of His description you feel the ...[text shortened]... age four. I had to look back at it myself.

Then let me know what you want to discuss.

Why do you always want people to go backwards and always read some previous post? It's like you live in the past or something. It's impossible to get you to move forward or stay in the here and now even.

It all just distracts from whatever point is being made to you in this present moment. I can only conclude that distraction and evasion is what you are up to. You do it to me . You play the same game with others. You simply cannot or will not answer or address a straight question.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
How many times did ToO ask you to read his OP?
look, probably I shouldn't be scoring this thread because I am not as well versed in the bible as you and ToO, but please...page after page of the same rubbish.
Maybe the score should've been -1/-1?

There was a decent discussion in the making there somewhere. It just couldn't get off the ground. One of us refused to discuss the issues.

Originally posted by knightmeister
Why do you always want people to go backwards and always read some previous post? It's like you live in the past or something. It's impossible to get you to move forward or stay in the here and now even.

It all just distracts from whatever point is being made to you in this present moment. I can only conclude that distraction and evasion is what y ...[text shortened]... e same game with others. You simply cannot or will not answer or address a straight question.

lol. Do you really need that explained to you? Sometimes points are missed, misunderstood or as seems likely with KJ forgotten. Most people are able to pick these points up once they have read it again. You have demonstrated time and again that you are not one of those people. Your comprehension is exceedingly weak. Perhaps it's because you immediately forget each sentence as you read it since you don't "live in the past" making it impossible for you to comprehend what is being said in the larger context.

One can only hope that you eventually overcome your delusions and become a rational being. Perhaps you can try reading LJ's posts again? While it's "it's in the past", there is much there for you to understand. You're living in denial.

BTW, since you don't seem to understand this, the ISSUE is "The Origin of God". Your ongoing attempts to hijack this and other threads does not change the issue. You are the one who has not discussed the issue despite your continued attempts to claim otherwise. You're living in denial.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
lol. Do you really need that explained to you? Sometimes points are missed, misunderstood or as seems likely with KJ forgotten. Most people are able to pick these points up once they have read it again. You have demonstrated time and again that you are not one of those people. Your comprehension is exceedingly weak. Perhaps it's because you immediately fo ...[text shortened]... issue despite your continued attempts to claim otherwise. You're living in denial.

None of that is true.

Originally posted by josephw
None of that is true.

The topic of this thread isn't "The Origin of God"?

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
The topic of this thread isn't "The Origin of God"?

No. That's just a delusion.

Originally posted by josephw
No. That's just a delusion.

Well, at least you admit it. It's the first step. Hopefully you'll eventually go the rest of the way.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Well, at least you admit it. It's the first step. Hopefully you'll eventually go the rest of the way.

Remember that scene in the movie with Robert Redford, Jeremiah Johnson, when he was looking at the eagle flying over the mountain?

I'm already there.

Originally posted by knightmeister
There was a decent discussion in the making there somewhere. It just couldn't get off the ground. One of us refused to discuss the issues.

You have a valid point of view in the matter, but it seemed like a really painstaking , windy road before you were prepared to admit that ToO also had a valid point. Thats why the discussion didn't get off the ground- there was no common ground to start with. 🙂 (Of course there were other issues that came out of that dialogue back there...)
edit:The other thing that I feel,(and correct me if I'm wrong), that you,(and ToO to a lesser degree), are trying to save face more than just say what you want to. You seem more worried about how you come off rather than having a meaningful debate.Who cares if you sound contreversial? Just listen to others as well as your own input, then its more of a 'discussion' rather than a 'lecture' ,(or semon?, I don't know, but I'm sure you have an inkling as to what I mean.)

Originally posted by karoly aczel
You have a valid point of view in the matter, but it seemed like a really painstaking , windy road before you were prepared to admit that ToO also had a valid point. Thats why the discussion didn't get off the ground- there was no common ground to start with. 🙂 (Of course there were other issues that came out of that dialogue back there...)
edit:The o lecture' ,(or semon?, I don't know, but I'm sure you have an inkling as to what I mean.)

but it seemed like a really painstaking , windy road before you were prepared to admit that ToO also had a valid point. Thats why the discussion didn't get off the ground- there was no common ground to start with.
----------------------------------karoly------------------------------

I would have thought the common ground was logic and what Jesus explicitly said? In my discussions with ToOne I frequently try to use whatever logic he/she uses and then reflect it back. If you look at ToO's posts over the last year or two he appeals to the simple logic of what Jesus explicitly says. So what I tried to do was to 1) use logic (eg - that Jesus would not ask his followers to confess their sins daily if he meant them to be utterly sinless) and 2) use the words of Jesus (eg Matt 6:9.

I have always said that ToO has a valid point. I have been saying it to him for years now. What I and others have asked from him is to accept the flies in the ointment of his position. He treats things as if he has a cut and dried case when he doesn't and takes such a catagorical position on things that he cannot entertain any discrepancies. He's an inverted fundie really.

I don't see what else I could do but use the rules which he defines . If he will not accept the logic and rules that he himself lays out then how can he hold onto the respect of others? I have even asked him to lay out some rules so a debate can take place. He refuses to do so and always has. He will not accept any "common ground" because he fears debate. He's built an impenetrable fortress around himself.

Me? I'm not interested in saving face. I'm interested in Truth. And truth gets discovered in the cauldron of debate and challenging your own thinking and others. I have always been ready to thrash out the truth with him but as soon as you challenge him he either runs off or accuses you of bigotry or delusion etc. Have a go if you don't believe me.

(Watch the reply below and see what happens)

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
lol. Do you really need that explained to you? Sometimes points are missed, misunderstood or as seems likely with KJ forgotten. Most people are able to pick these points up once they have read it again. You have demonstrated time and again that you are not one of those people. Your comprehension is exceedingly weak. Perhaps it's because you immediately fo ...[text shortened]... issue despite your continued attempts to claim otherwise. You're living in denial.

One can only hope that you eventually overcome your delusions and become a rational being. Perhaps you can try reading LJ's posts again? While it's "it's in the past", there is much there for you to understand. You're living in denial.
---------------ToO--------------------

I'll do you a deal. I will go back and address an issue you want me to address and then after I have done that will you then address the Matt6:9 v John 8:32 issue?

All I ask is that you are more explicit about what it is you want me to address. No nebulus, woolly hints , just straight and explicit. Keep it simple. In return I will address whatever you want me to in shall we say 5 posts? Then after that 5 posts on Matt6:9? How about I load the dice in your favour and make it 10 posts to 5?

How much fairer can I be? The problem is I almost think I know what you'll do. We've been here before .......