The Pharisee and the Tax Collector - Unraveled

Luke 18 ESV

9 He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’ 13 But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”

Many Christians seem to mistakenly believe that in the text in bold above, Jesus is saying that the tax collector is "justified" in the absolute sense rather than the relative sense. So they "beat [their] breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!" -figuratively and/or literally - expecting to be "justified" in the absolute sense as well.

Perversely this leads them to "[trust] in themselves that they [are] righteous" as well.

@thinkofone said
Luke 18 ESV

9 He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like ...[text shortened]... as well.

Perversely this leads them to "[trust] in themselves that they [are] righteous" as well.

@divegeester said
As well as justification through him, Jesus also claimed to offer eternal life.

Was he correct?

@divegeester said
As well as justification through him, Jesus also claimed to offer eternal life.

Was he correct?

@ThinkOfOne

That brings up a good point. Many Christians seem to mistakenly believe that if one believes in the atoning sacrifice and resurrection of Christ one will receive eternal life, live in the Kingdom and be imputed righteousness.

This leads them to "[trust] in themselves that they [are] righteous" as well.

Many Christians seem to mistakenly believe that if one believes in the atoning sacrifice and resurrection of Christ one will receive eternal life, live in the Kingdom and be imputed righteousness.

But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became wisdom to us from God, both righteousness and sanctification and redemption,

That as it is written, He who boasts, let him boast in the Lord." (1 Cor. 1;30)

@sonship said
@ThinkOfOne

That brings up a good point. Many Christians seem to mistakenly believe that if one believes in the atoning sacrifice and resurrection of Christ one will receive eternal life, live in the Kingdom and be imputed righteousness.

This leads them to "[trust] in themselves that they [are] righteous" as well.

How is that? Explain this a bit more.

@thinkofone said
That brings up a good point. Many Christians seem to mistakenly believe that if one believes in the atoning sacrifice and resurrection of Christ one will receive eternal life, live in the Kingdom and be imputed righteousness.

This leads them to "[trust] in themselves that they [are] righteous" as well.

@divegeester said
My question may well "bring up a good point" in your mind but basically it is just you dodging the question.


As well as justification through him, Jesus also claimed to offer eternal life.
Was he correct?

Both the Pharisee and those Christians judge themselves righteous even when they are not in fact righteous as judged by the words spoken by Jesus during His ministry. Jesus said, "“He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day." Those who truly keep His commandments and truly abide in His word are the truly righteous.

In the basic book of Christian doctrine Romans, the dividing line between Paul's explanation of these two aspects of God's full salvation is pretty much drawn at Romans 5:9,10. He goes from a believer's positional standing of being justified in Christ to his subjective dispositional sanctification in which his living becomes more and more an expression of Christ's living.

"Much more then, having now been justified in His blood, we will be saved through Him from the wrath. (v.9)

For if we, being enemies, were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more we will be saved in His life, having been reconciled." (v.10)

ToO,

If you are not saved through the redeeming blood of Christ from the coming wrath, there is no use in asking if you are participating in the subjective salvation " in His life " of sanctification. If your former answer amounts to a negative - ie. the blood of Christ has done nothing for you, then probably you don't care to be saved in the realm and sphere of His resurrection life imparted into you as the Holy Spirit.

You are headed for the wrath of God.
Get out from there and ask Christ to immediately place you in Himself.

"Much more then, having now been justified in His blood, we will be saved through Him from the wrath. (v.9)

For if we, being enemies, were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more we will be saved in His life, having been reconciled." (v.10) (Rom. 5:9,10)

@thinkofone said
Actually it is me choosing to not address your red herring.

Since you still don't seem to understand the concept, you should take the time to understand this:
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/150/Red-Herring

Educate yourself.

@divegeester said
So my checkmate questions which you repeatedly ignore, are “red herrings” are they.

They are just questions about the words of Jesus ToO, I thought you loved the words of Jesus...?

@karoly-aczel said
checkmate questions?

lol... your questions are shallow and 'off the cuff' .