10 Oct 05
Originally posted by lucifershammerI'm sorry, but what is the idea behind this post of yours?
The following is an abbreviated form of an article that appeared in a Catholic paper some time back:
My brother
The August sun was shining through the apartment windows and my brother was lying face down on the floor. The arpeggios of Beethoven filled the bright room, but all I could think of was the strange mundanity of seeing Tom's battered ...[text shortened]... experience of this sister and her parents? Any other comments on their thinking and the article?
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by Bosse de NageIn this case, the sister cut off her brother for a long time - so clearly lifestyle had an impact on their relationship.
Would their lifestyle have no effect on how you dealt with them? Would you, for example, counsel them to change their ways.
What do you think the effect of all this was on the brother? The article does not mention that much (and so, I think, they have a long way to go yet in recovering their former closeness).
10 Oct 05
1 edit
Originally posted by lucifershammerReminds me of a friend of mine--after he'd told his parents the good news, his mother cut up all his clothes & wouldn't speak to him for a year. Now they are closer than ever before. His father seems to have misfiled the issue somewhere, he likes to talk about the weather.
Mum and dad wept, talked, accepted what they couldn't at that time understand and in the end blessed him with furniture for his apartment. I, meanwhile, left rejected and unwilling to hear his explanations, all but cut him off.
What has helped us come to terms with Tom's decision has been the simple passing of time.
My sister is a gay (Methodist) Christian. My father is severely homophobic, my mother's views somewhat Calvinist--imagine what fun we all had on her coming out. Even so, a couple years later, grudging acceptance seems to be the status quo.
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by lucifershammerIt's a normal case of someone overcoming her prejudices, in this case religiously-induced. First denial, then acceptance. I don't see anything remarkable in the case, hence my curiosity...
To know what people (particularly atheists) think of the sister's thoughts, actions etc.
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by Palynka(Sorry about that last one)
It's a normal case of someone overcoming her prejudices, in this case religiously-induced. First denial, then acceptance. I don't see anything remarkable in the case, hence my curiosity...
It's a normal case of someone overcoming her prejudices, in this case religiously-induced.
In this forum, we've long discussed the prejudices of the religious and, in recent times, the prejudices of the atheists (regarding religion and the religious).
Do you think this family's experience might be replicated in a modern, secular/liberal family if the son chooses religion?
10 Oct 05
I feel that respect is the wrong word for the sister to use. She obviously believes homosexuality to be a sin and therefore her brother will burn in hell for being a sinner. She probably continues to hold out hope that he will repent of his 'lifestyle', despite what she says. To use the word respect is misplaced, I believe she endures his situation because her faith is not as powerful as her biological or social debt to him as her brother. If this is not the case and she does respect him, she is going against god's will as she sees it and therefore probably going to hell too.
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by lucifershammerShe makes explicit that she respects his lifestyle.
Do you think the sister is talking about respect for her brother's lifestyle or respecting his [autonomy in] decision?
How far do you think the sister has understood her brother's experience and decision?
"In the end, siblings choose a lifestyle, and Tom's is just odder than most. I don't exactly understand it, but I respect it."
'It' cannot refer to "choose a lifestyle."
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by DoctorScribbles'It' cannot refer to "choose a lifestyle."
She makes explicit that she respects his lifestyle.
"In the end, siblings choose a [b]lifestyle, and Tom's is just odder than most. I don't exactly understand it, but I respect it."
'It' cannot refer to "choose a lifestyle."[/b]
Why not? Why can't the referent of 'it' be 'choice' (noun of 'choose'😉 here?
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by lucifershammerBecause 'choice' doesn't appear in the sentence.
[b]'It' cannot refer to "choose a lifestyle."
Why not? Why can't the referent of 'it' be 'choice' (noun of 'choose'😉 here?[/b]
Pronouns can't refer to any old phrase of a sentence. Under your claim about ambiguous antecedants, which you seem to think we have here, they refer to the closest relevant noun, which in this case must be 'lifestyle.'
10 Oct 05
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesBut, apparently, you've demolished my claim about the closest referent - so why should it hold here?
Because 'choice' doesn't appear in the sentence.
Pronouns can't refer to any old phrase of a sentence. Under your claim about ambiguous antecedants, which you seem to think we have here, they refer to the closest relevant noun, which in this case must be 'lifestyle.'
Further, IMO 'choice' is a better object for 'understand' than 'lifestyle' (What's there to understand about a lifestyle?)