Originally posted by @fmfActually, based on the description you give about your "Christian experience" I'd say that what you had was a spiritually dead Christian experience.
You are describing strong Christian faith that lasted for decades (not including my childhood) as a "braindead experience"?
In spite of your continual decrying of your "decades long" brainwashed Christian experience no one I've ever met in the 30+ years I've been saved that has ever known the risen Lord Jesus Christ has ever turned back from that knowledge.
Simply put, you never knew Jesus. You were never born again. You only had a religious experience. If you had had real faith you would never deny the resurrection nor any of the other fundamentals of the faith.
Instead you have chosen to believe that God is merely a "figure" and not a reality.
Originally posted by @josephwI most certainly felt spiritually alive all through those years, and I have no regrets and no amount of time can diminish the vividness and impact of that spiritually alive feeling. Indeed, I still feel spiritually alive, although the basis for that feeling is now to do with metaphysics and not to do with supernatural notions.
I'd say that what you had was a spiritually dead Christian experience.
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Originally posted by @josephwOK, I hear what you say.
Simply put, you never knew Jesus.
As you know, I no longer subscribe to the claims that Christians make about Jesus - about "knowing" him, and him still being alive, and about the supernatural significance of his death etc. etc. Even if you were to say 'Hey, you did know Jesus but now you don't', it would be nonplussing, to say the least.
So, I agree with you in so far as I now believe that there was never an actual Jesus figure there for me to "know" in the way you think there is. I say this regardless of how real it was to me and how certain I was back then.
Presumably, if ever you lose your faith, there will be Christians around you who will say about you: 'Simply put, josephw never knew Jesus'. And they will, of course, be right ~ albeit not for the reason they think.
Originally posted by @josephwI have done no such "continual decrying" of the kind. I was enthralled, gripped, animated, propelled, guided, protected by faith. Not "brainwashed". There have been things you've said in your responses on this thread that make me wonder if you actually understood the OP at all and whether you are able to discern the spirit in which it was written.
In spite of your continual decrying of your "decades long" brainwashed Christian experience...
Originally posted by @fmfFor decades, you say, you held to the faith and was "enthralled, gripped, animated, propelled, guided, protected by faith", but then you fell from grace.
I have done no such "continual decrying" of the kind. I was enthralled, gripped, animated, propelled, guided, protected by faith. Not "brainwashed". There have been things you've said in your responses on this thread that make me wonder if you actually understood the OP at all and whether you are able to discern the spirit in which it was written.
No wonder it's a pet peeve of yours to punish yourself for wasting so many years of your life following a delusion by decrying the experience and putting believers to the task of unraveling your prolific and continual confounding of any reply made to your posts that are essentially an apology for being so duped for believing in Jesus.
Why don't you just get on with what's left of your life and quit wasting more of ours and your life. You're never going to find proof here that you're wrong.
Originally posted by @josephwYes. That's right. Although I obviously don't believe that "grace" exists. I think it is something Christians imagine exists. But I do acknowledge that it gives people who are Christians the same meaning and purpose as it gave me back then.
For decades, you say, you held to the faith and was "enthralled, gripped, animated, propelled, guided, protected by faith", but then you fell from grace.
Originally posted by @josephwI don't punish myself at all. I don't think I wasted any years of my life. I don't decry the experience. I don't feel I was duped and have never said anything here that would suggest that. Perhaps you don't pay attention. If "putting believers to task" refers to me participating in a Spirituality Forum for believers and non-believers, then yes I do that - and I accept the words "prolific" and "continual" being applied to me. Aside from that, you seem to be a poor judge of character and motivation ~ at least when it comes to me. 😉
No wonder it's a pet peeve of yours to punish yourself for wasting so many years of your life following a delusion by decrying the experience and putting believers to the task of unraveling your prolific and continual confounding of any reply made to your posts that are essentially an apology for being so duped for believing in Jesus.
Originally posted by @josephwYou mean, stop posting? Only play chess? Leave the web site? No thanks, I quite enjoy being part of this community. If you feel my contributions are wasting your time, you shouldn't bother reading them (as I suspect may have been the case on this thread). And as for you wasting time replying to my posts, that is not something you can blame on anyone except yourself.
Why don't you just get on with what's left of your life and quit wasting more of ours and your life.
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Originally posted by @fmfWhat 'meaning and purpose' did 'grace' give you back in the day?
Yes. That's right. Although I obviously don't believe that "grace" exists. I think it is something Christians imagine exists. But I do acknowledge that it gives people who are Christians the same meaning and purpose as it gave me back then.
Originally posted by @dj2beckerThe same meaning and purpose for Christians that I have talked about and explained countless times here, including on threads where you were contributing and in posts written and aďressed to you.
What 'meaning and purpose' did 'grace' give you back in the day?
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Originally posted by @fmfI have never specifically asked you about grace, but oh well the predictable rip cord I'm-not-interested-in-answering-your-question-response should have been expected.
The same meaning and purpose for Christians that I have talked about and explained countless times here, including on threads where you were contributing and in posts written and aďressed to you.