What are the rules...

Originally posted by yoctobyte
Using the Bible as a point of reference...

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Can you show us a culture which before seeing the ten commandments
thought that killing was good? What exactly has the ten commandments
shown anyone?
Using the Bible as a point of reference...

1. The earth prior to the flood
2. Sodom and Gomorrah

http://nickfanon.wikia.com/wiki/File: Picard-facepalm.jpg

Originally posted by yoctobyte
Using the Bible as a point of reference...

1. The earth prior to the flood
2. Sodom and Gomorrah

What about African, American and Asian cultures prior to Christianity?

Were they all ignorant of the fact that murder was bad?

Originally posted by C Hess
No, I'm pretty sure it's an evolved ability, made clear by the fact that not everyone possess it to the same degree.

Actually there are other strong indications that it is evolved. For example our tendency to give greater value to members of our own group in a tiered structure (direct family, extended family, local group, nationality, race etc) is explainable by evolution, but not explained by religion.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Actually there are other strong indications that it is evolved. For example our tendency to give greater value to members of our own group in a tiered structure (direct family, extended family, local group, nationality, race etc) is explainable by evolution, but not explained by religion.

Thank you.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
What about African, American and Asian cultures prior to Christianity?

Were they all ignorant of the fact that murder was bad?

You tell me, I am not that studied up on history. Do you think they were? If not why not?

Originally posted by yoctobyte
[bThe Ten Commandments were given to show what was wrong, [/b]

How do you back up this statement?
If true pre-Christian cultures would surely exhibit morals contrary to
the ten commandments. So you should havce examples.

If not - on what do you base your statement?

Originally posted by yoctobyte
You tell me, I am not that studied up on history.

Then do not make historical claims.

Originally posted by Great King Rat
And what shapes our material wants and needs?

advertising i would say.

Originally posted by yoctobyte
... for determining morality?

In another thread I asked the question "What are the rules for determining morality?" For atheists, without using the bible or any religion, what guides and forms your morality?

False assumption from the git go. Philosophers recognize forms of morality which do not presuppose rules. See, for example, "role ethics" -- google that, if unsure.

Originally posted by moonbus
False assumption from the git go. Philosophers recognize forms of morality which do not presuppose rules. See, for example, "role ethics" -- google that, if unsure.

Are you saying atheists are philosophers?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Then do not make historical claims.

I made no historical claims outside of your original question; you expanded your question to include other cultures, for which I have no real information, as I said not really a history buff.

edit: Are you a history buff?

Originally posted by yoctobyte
Are you saying atheists are philosophers?

No. I'm saying there are forms of morality not based on rules and rule-following. The Judeo-Christian-Islamic tradition is based on Mosaic Law and represents only one paradigm of morality. There are others. Philosophers happen to have names for these other paradigms. See, for example, "virtue ethics" -- google it, if unsure.

Originally posted by moonbus
No. I'm saying there are forms of morality not based on rules and rule-following. The Judeo-Christian-Islamic tradition is based on Mosaic Law and represents only one paradigm of morality. There are others. Philosophers happen to have names for these other paradigms. See, for example, "virtue ethics" -- google it, if unsure.

So... what is your basis?

Originally posted by yoctobyte
So... what is your basis?

There are a whole bunch of different philosophical groundings of secular ethics...

But they all have one thing in common.

They are built upon people and the reality we live in.

One way or another that is always the basis.

Originally posted by yoctobyte
I made no historical claims outside of your original question; you expanded your question to include other cultures,

You said "The Ten Commandments were given to show what was wrong"

I am playing along with your faith and not disputing that the Ten Commandments were given to us by your god. I am questioning
your statement that they were to show us right from wrong. Since
it happened in the past it is an historical question and I assumed that
the Ten Commandments were for everyone.

So unless you are saying the Commandments were just for some desert nomads explain how they influenced other cultures around the world with
reference to knowing what is wrong.