Originally posted by DeepThoughtDid any atheist claim any such thing, or was it a strawman by Suzianne? I think you will find that most atheists who participated in the thread talked about what Jesus is recorded as having wanted during his lifetime. I for one have never claimed 'Jesus wants you to ....'.
Suzianne has a point, an atheist either thinks that Jesus was just a man who died a couple of thousand years ago or thinks he didn't exist at all; either way they can't consistently claim that Jesus wants anything at all.
Originally posted by FreakyKBHC'mon Freaky.
So--- if I have this straight--- it's hilarious once, even hilarious twice, but at the end of all it, it's really just sad.
Maybe you should invest in a good internet thesaurus.
"I think it hilarious" was used for effect as literary repetition of the phrase used by Suzianne.
I then stated how I actually feel about it.
At least you allowed for the fact that you don't "have this straight", so I'll give you that.
Originally posted by DeepThoughtHow does this logically follow?
Suzianne has a point, an atheist either thinks that Jesus was just a man who died a couple of thousand years ago or thinks he didn't exist at all; either way they can't consistently claim that Jesus wants anything at all.
The post that was quoted here has been removedYours is a very interesting post, regarding my grammar. It did not occur at all to me to use the word *did*, which would imply past tense. When I created the title I instinctively used the word *does*, which, as you pointed out would imply *present tense*, or that Jesus still lives. Without completely realizing that point about myself, it would imply that I believe Jesus, in fact, still lives. Very eye-opening for me. Thanks.
Maybe one step closer to a better belief, and a step away from unbelief?
Originally posted by chaney3Congratulations, you're starting to 'get it'.
Yours is a very interesting post, regarding my grammar. It did not occur at all to me to use the word *did*, which would imply past tense. When I created the title I instinctively used the word *does*, which, as you pointed out would imply *present tense*, or that Jesus still lives. Without completely realizing that point about myself, it would imply that ...[text shortened]... ing for me. Thanks.
Maybe one step closer to a better belief, and a step away from unbelief?
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Originally posted by chaney3We all have a certain amount of doubt, otherwise there is no faith.
I'm not exactly sure anymore what a 'Christian' is. So, I don't know.
Is a Christian someone who posts 'good riddance' when news of Prince's death is reported? Like Rakj999 said in his post above, can someone SAY they are a Christian and then their actions and words prove otherwise?
I cited the verse from Mark because I have belief.....but also unbelief, and am willing to try to learn.
So why faith? I suppose it is because Biblically those who knew that God existed, lost faith in him. Examples include Adam and Eve, or even the children of Israel as they made the golden calf to worship after watching God separate the Red sea and give them manna from heaven to eat.
Faith is something that is involved in any loving relationship. It is a natural outcome. Those we love we place our faith in. Being a Christian has more to do with your relationship with Christ and those who live their lives for him than anything else. It is simply a walk, not a destination. It is simply being in tune with his will for your life and the world and walking in his plan for both.
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The post that was quoted here has been removedSo you think it might be just a matter of semantics? Could very well be, but hopefully DT (and Suzianne?) weren't thinking along such trite lines.
Even at that, a case can be pretty readily made that conceptually Jesus saw His teachings as being applicable to the future as well as His current times with His intended audience stretching into eternity (the phrase "eternal life" is interesting in that respect). As such His words and the concepts that they convey "live" in the present as well as the past. I often use the present tense when speaking of the teaching of Jesus with that concept in mind.
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I wrote above in a post that Jesus lived by the Father and said those who "eat" Him will also live by Him. (John 6:57)
When you examine the life and words of the Apostle Paul in his letters you see a man who lived by Jesus just as Jesus lived by the Father. We thank God for a model of such a God-man. And he said that he learned "the secret."
In all his very tough troubling circumstances Paul left us a model. He learned the secret to live through Christ as Christ lived by the Father.
" ... I have learned the secret both to be filled and to hunger, both to abound and to lack.
I am able to do all things in Him who empowers me." (Phil. 4:12b-13)
Being such a faithful pioneer of living by the indwelling resurrected Christ as the life giving Spirit, he urged others to observe his success and learn from it.
"The things which you have also learned and received and heard and seen in me, practice these things; and the God of peace will be with you." (v.9)
