1. Joined
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    28 Apr '07 18:50
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
  2. CA, USA
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    28 Apr '07 18:52
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
    You mean self-awareness?

    A conscience?

    Instinct of what's good and what's evil?
  3. Felicific Forest
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    28 Apr '07 19:33
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
    So, God did not punish the snake, right ?
  4. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    Royal Oak, MI
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    28 Apr '07 20:16
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
    It's not that god "let the serpent into the garden", but rather that god made the serpent and placed him in the garden.

    Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtle than any other wild creature that the Lord God had made.
  5. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 03:01
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
    You're in denial. It's your own guilt.
  6. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    29 Apr '07 10:47
    Originally posted by josephw
    You're in denial. It's your own guilt.
    I wouldn't go in De nile for anything, it's too muddy.
  7. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 15:29
    Originally posted by josephw
    You're in denial. It's your own guilt.
    😵 why is it always the person... always the human race to blame..? religion always points the finger back at us, never at god...

    why cant god be to blame, don't you think god ever makes mistakes..?
  8. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    29 Apr '07 16:002 edits
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    😵 why is it always the person... always the human race to blame..? religion always points the finger back at us, never at god...

    why cant god be to blame, don't you think god ever makes mistakes..?
    Considering the entire purpose of religion, especially the christian, Jewish and Islam ones (and the diabolically opposed versions)
    is specifically designed to control people and specifically women, having in actuality nothing to do with real spirituality, there will never be a time where these so-called religions will admit a failure in their insane gods.
  9. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 16:36
    Originally posted by eatmybishop
    when you look at the history of Christianity, have you ever wondered how much god likes to inflict guilt on the human race... for example: if god knows all things in advance, why did he let the snake into the garden..?

    (another example of inflicting guilt on the human race)
    I wouldn't leave a seven year alone in a room with a loaded gun on the table, so why would God put the apple on the tree?
  10. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    29 Apr '07 17:12
    Originally posted by jonas555
    I wouldn't leave a seven year alone in a room with a loaded gun on the table, so why would God put the apple on the tree?
    Because it didn't.
  11. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 18:01
    Yes, God allowed the serpant and Eve to meet at the tree. God allowed the serpant and Eve to have a conversation and God not only allowed Eve to eat the fruit but allowed her to give it to Adam.
    Beyond that, God gave us questioning, independant minds.

    In the garden God had only one "Thou shalt not" rule. God told Adam and eve not to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. He knew they would, after all he is God.

    So ultimately is man's moral failure God's fault? I believe it is.

    Why would a God who loves us, with love greater than the love we have for our children, allow us to disobey him?

    He could force us all to be pure and holy. He could force us to love Him the way he wants us to. But if He did, would the love be real or would it be just another creation?

    I believe God allows us to sin so that the love He receives from us is tried and proven.

    The bigger problem is the consequence for our sin.
    Romans 6:23 says " For the wage of sin is death...".

    DEATH! HELL! That's pretty severe consequences for something that God was ultimately responsible for. This does not sound fair and just!

    The Bible assures us over and over that God is just and that his judgements are fair and righteous. So how do we reconcile this seemingly unjust situation?

    The rest of Romans 6:23 says "For the wage of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

    John 3:16 says "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

    OK, how does that work?
    Ultimately God allowed us to sin. He allowed the situation and he has provided a fair and just way to solve the problem.

    God became flesh and dwelt among us (John 1:1-14) and then He paid the price for all of us. God in the form of a man was sinless yet He suffered the punishment for our sins.

    The good news is that "...while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." Romans 5:8
    This means that THE SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN!!! GLORY TO GOD FOR HIS RIGHTEOUS JUDGEMENT AND PRAISE HIM FOR HIS GREAT LOVE FOR US!!!
    Sorry, I get carried away sometimes. This message is worth shouting about though.

    So if your sins are already forgiven does that give you a "get out of hell free" card?

    God has made good on His responsibility for allowing us to be sinners, but just like a cut on your hand leaves a scar, sin has left you with a spiritual scar. Your sin has left you with spirit that is dead before God. Your dead spirit hates God and loves sin.

    The responsibility of allowing us to be sinners doesn't seem to be completely resolved. How did God fix this dead spirit thing?

    In John 3:3 Jesus said"...except a man be born again, he cannot see the Kingdom Of God."

    When Jesus rose from the dead, He defeated death and made our justification possible. If you accept Jesus as your saviour, you are accepting His Spirit to dwell within you. Thus with a new eternal Spirit dwelling in you, you are born again and you become a new creature in Him.
    Galatians 2:20 says "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me."

    Now the price has been paid and eternal life is available to all who will accept the free gift from a loving God.

    What more can a loving God do than to pay all the prices and offer his love and life to you?

    John 3:16-18
    16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
    17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
    18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    God stands and says " I love you. Here is a free gift that will allow you to be with me forever."

    Will you love him or will you be among those who are already condemned?

    Praise God

    GR
  12. Donationbbarr
    Chief Justice
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    29 Apr '07 18:07
    Originally posted by GlenR
    Yes, God allowed the serpant and Eve to meet at the tree. God allowed the serpant and Eve to have a conversation and God not only allowed Eve to eat the fruit but allowed her to give it to Adam.
    Beyond that, God gave us questioning, independant minds.

    In the garden God had only one "Thou shalt not" rule. God told Adam and eve not to eat the fruit of the ...[text shortened]... or will you be among those who are already condemned?

    Praise God

    GR
    Out od curiosity, what do you think Hell is like from the perspective of the condemned?
  13. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 18:29
    Originally posted by GlenR
    Yes, God allowed the serpant and Eve to meet at the tree. God allowed the serpant and Eve to have a conversation and God not only allowed Eve to eat the fruit but allowed her to give it to Adam.
    Beyond that, God gave us questioning, independant minds.

    In the garden God had only one "Thou shalt not" rule. God told Adam and eve not to eat the fruit of the ...[text shortened]... or will you be among those who are already condemned?

    Praise God

    GR
    Specifically, what does it mean to "accept Jesus as your saviour...accept His Spirit to dwell within you."
  14. Joined
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    29 Apr '07 18:38
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Because it didn't.
    I'm sorry, I don't understand. What does the "it" in your reply refer to? God?
  15. Illinois
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    29 Apr '07 19:58
    Originally posted by GlenR
    In the garden God had only one "Thou shalt not" rule. God told Adam and eve not to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. He knew they would, after all he is God.

    So ultimately is man's moral failure God's fault? I believe it is.
    If God is responsible for our moral failure, then there is injustice in God. But the scriptures say clearly otherwise:

    "Are we saying, then, that God was unfair? Of course not!" (Romans 9:14).

    "God is light, and there is no darkness in him at all" (1 John 1:15).

    We are responsible for disobeying God, and God, because of His mercy and righteousness, has given us a way out of the rightful condemnation for disobeying Him. If God were responsible, then His salavation would not be called 'grace'. The definition of 'grace' is 'undeserved kindness'. If God were responsible, we would deserve such kindness.
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