Why are atheist on a spirituality Forum?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
where else are you going to examine them? huh? no its not circular at all, its a matter
of, there are no other writings anywhere else, your objection is unfounded, like, i dont
want to study Shakespeare because his works are contained in the Complete works of
Shakespeare, huh? 😕

I can study the works of Shakespeare but i'm not making a judgement on whether they are an historical fact or not. I can pretty much conclude from reading them that they are a work of fiction. So do you, unless you're more bonkers than i think you are already.

Originally posted by Agerg
I find it difficult to parse your long posts, and extract the nature of your challenge...care to spell it out for me!???

thank you, you cannot state with any certainty that Jesus did not in fact perform
miracles, to you, it simply seems, improbable. Seeing your reluctance to discuss any
of the gospel accounts, I will, at some point need to start my own thread, and lay bare
the details from the ancient sacred text, then, you will have no recourse to these
outrageous claims, that Jesus never performed miracles any further.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
I can study the works of Shakespeare but i'm not making a judgement on whether they are an historical fact or not. I can pretty much conclude from reading them that they are a work of fiction. So do you, unless you're more bonkers than i think you are already.

your sole objection was, that they are contained in the Bible, hardly a compelling
argument, not to look at them, is it dear Noobster?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
where else are you going to examine them? huh? no its not circular at all, its a matter
of, there are no other writings anywhere else, your objection is unfounded, like, i dont
want to study Shakespeare because his works are contained in the Complete works of
Shakespeare, huh? 😕

This boils down to:
Only one book contains writings about Jesus - this book says Jesus was magic - Ergo Jesus existed and was magic!??? 😕

I could apply that methodology to the writings of Tolkein and conclude hobbits and mythril armour existed existed.

Originally posted by Agerg
This boils down to:
Only one book contains writings about Jesus - this book says Jesus was magic - Ergo Jesus existed and was magic!??? 😕

I could apply that methodology to the writings of Tolkein and conclude hobbits and mythril armour existed existed.

yes you could, but you would also be challenged on the integrity of the text, as to its
details, whether they appear to portray details known to be correct. For example if
you read in your Tolkein book that Frodo Baggins won the ring on an on-line
competition, you would have reason to doubt the validity of the text, for the internet
was not invented way back in the time of dragons, were they?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
thank you, you cannot state with any certainty that Jesus did not in fact perform
miracles, to you, it simply seems, improbable. Seeing your reluctance to discuss any
of the gospel accounts, I will, at some point need to start my own thread, and lay bare
the details from the ancient sacred text, then, you will have no recourse to these
outrageous claims, that Jesus never performed miracles any further.

To reiterate my last response...:

So I have to conclude that Jesus performed miracles based on the claims made in the Bible he performed miracles, and because there is no other source of information about Jesus other than the Bible!???

What if...hmm......yeah tricky that one......lemme think about it for a moment

*thinking*

*...still thinking (this is difficult)*

*......still thinking*

Eureka!!!! I have just had a thought! What if the Bible is not a historically accurate document and is full of exagerations and false claims?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
your sole objection was, that they are contained in the Bible, hardly a compelling
argument, not to look at them, is it dear Noobster?

It's not an argument whether to look at them or not, but an argument to ascertain how credible they are.

Originally posted by Agerg
To reiterate my last response...:

So I have to conclude that Jesus performed miracles based on the claims made in the Bible he performed miracles, and because there is no other source of information about Jesus other than the Bible!???

What if...hmm......yeah tricky that one......lemme think about it for a moment

*thinking*

*...still thinking (this ...[text shortened]... the Bible is not a historically accurate document and is full of exagerations and false claims?

you could examine the text and find out, although i think i have already pre guessed
your apparent objection above.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes you could, but you would also be challenged on the integrity of the text, as to its
details, whether they appear to portray details known to be correct. For example if
you read in your Tolkein book that Frodo Baggins won the ring on an on-line
competition, you would have reason to doubt the validity of the text, for the internet
was not invented way back in the time of dragons, were they?

The text doesn't say he won it on an online competition though. Indeed, can you prove Frodo Baggins didn't exist and infact middle Earth wasn't an actual place?

Originally posted by Proper Knob
It's not an argument whether to look at them or not, but an argument to ascertain how credible they are.

well, lets see, your hardly going to be able to tell, without looking at them, are you?

Originally posted by Agerg
The text doesn't say he won it on an online competition though. Indeed, can you prove Frodo Baggins didn't exist and infact middle Earth wasn't an actual place?

yes of course, because the element is not there, if it were it would be incongruous, disharmonious, this is not the case with the gospel, every detail, harmonises.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes of course, because the element is not there, if it were it would be incongruous, disharmonious, this is not the case with the gospel, every detail, harmonises.

Middle Earth isn't here now; that much is true but can you prove it didn't exist in the past? Perhaps Gandalf magicked the world we know now into being from what it was prior.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
well, lets see, your hardly going to be able to tell, without looking at them, are you?

Well i've just read John 1-12. Jesus turning water into wine at the wedding.

Now what?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes of course, because the element is not there, if it were it would be incongruous, disharmonious, this is not the case with the gospel, every detail, harmonises.

look you bad ol puddy cats, your on to a hiding to nothing here, you cannot state that
miracles did not happen all you can say is that you have not sufficient knowledge at
present, either of science or of the miracles themselves, all you can state is that they
seem to you improbable. you have objected to looking at scripture on the flimsiest of
basis, the only course left for me, is to prove the integrity of the text myself. Again,
for the fiftieth millionth time.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes of course, because the element is not there, if it were it would be incongruous, disharmonious, this is not the case with the gospel, every detail, harmonises.

Middle Earth isn't here now; that much is true but can you prove it didn't exist in the past? Perhaps Gandalf magicked the world we know now into being from what it was prior. Tolkein's books suggest he was a very powerful wizard so we can't just discount the idea without investigating Tolkein's books (and when you do they will indeed tell you all about hobbits and middle earth and magic)!