Originally posted by josephwThat line of argument will never succeed until you at least demonstrate how I cannot substitute for your god, Gandalf, Thor, the FSM, the IPU, Larry the Leprechaun, and so on...
Either way, I failed.
For now that is.
The existence of the universe is not and never will be a proof that your "God" exists. Try a different approach, you might catch one of those who are teetering.
Originally posted by AgergIf there is a God, and one needs physical proof, then the universe is proof.
That line of argument will never succeed until you at least demonstrate how I cannot substitute for your god, Gandalf, Thor, the FSM, the IPU, Larry the Leprechaun, and so on...
The existence of the universe is not and never will be a proof that your "God" exists. Try a different approach, you might catch one of those who are teetering.
Do you know any teeterers? lol
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Originally posted by josephwIf there is a God, and one needs physical proof, then the universe is proof.
If there is a God, and one needs physical proof, then the universe is proof.
Do you know any teeterers? lol
Give it up! an argument that "God" only has one syllable and it's quicker to say that name than any other would be a more compelling line of attack than the one you've been trying. The universe is proof of Gandalf.
I know of no teeterers...and I wouldn't want to be responsible, even indirectly, for causing a single person to become a fundamentalist of any religion supposing I did.
Originally posted by AgergSo how did the universe come into existence? Do you know?
[b]If there is a God, and one needs physical proof, then the universe is proof.
Give it up! an argument that "God" only has one syllable and it's quicker to say that name than any other would be a more compelling line of attack than the one you've been trying. The universe is proof of Gandalf.
I know of no teeterers...and I wouldn't want to be respons ...[text shortened]... ly, for causing a single person to become a fundamentalist of any religion supposing I did.[/b]
Originally posted by RJHindsHow could he have been 'the only begotten son of God' when he had 4 brothers and two sisters? Were his siblings admonished concerning their knowledge of being called by God too? What made JC so special in his family, to be called out as the 'only' one?
Jesus the Christ, the only begotten Son of God, referred to God
as "my Father". How clearer can you get?
All seems a bit 'Eastendery' to me. 😉
Originally posted by mikelomNow in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a
How could he have been 'the only begotten son of God' when he had 4 brothers and two sisters? Were his siblings admonished concerning their knowledge of being called by God too? What made JC so special in his family, to be called out as the 'only' one?
All seems a bit 'Eastendery' to me. 😉
virgin engaged to a man whose name was Joseph, of the decendents
of David; and the virgin's name was Mary. And coming in, he said to
her, "Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you." But she was greatly
troubled at this statement, and kept pondering what kind of
salutation this might be. And the angel said to her, "Do not be
afraid, Mary; for you have found favor with God. And behold, you
will conceive in your womb, and bear a son, and you shall call Him
Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most HIgh;
and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David; and
He will reign over the house of Jacob forever; and His kingdom will
have no end." And Mary said to the angel, "How can this be, since
I am a virgin?" And the angel answered and said to her, "The Holy
Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will
overshadow you; and for that reason the holy offspring shall be
called the Son of God." Luke 1:26-35
Read it carefully and you will see why Jesus was so special.
Originally posted by gambit3My point was that the old judeo-chriastian and islamic religious thought held Woman as inferior to Man. Pl.see page 58 of Dawkins' book ' God Delusion ' 2006 edition.
Eve coming from a Adam's rib is inferior to the man called Adam who came from some part of the earth? Some topsoil is superior to a rib bone? I do not know how God did the recreation but one way is as good as another. Side to side is even. I never have heard the Churches I have been in teach that the woman nor women are inferior. I have heard men and women complain about each other. What else is new?
Originally posted by AgergIf there was proof, then there would be no need for Faith.
There's plenty of evidence that your "God" doesn't exist...firstly it is a logically incoherent god given the properties you ascribe to it but more importantly there is not one shred of valid, testable evidence that any god exists let alone yours.
The only evidence you have is fear of death, conditioning, and circular reasoning.
That's why there is no proof.
Originally posted by SuzianneI acknowledge that, indeed any request on my part for a proof of "God"'s existence I recognise as one that will be taken rhetorically, to illustrate a point, by the person whom I'm speaking to. That said, it's a useful device when hit with the old - "you can't prove God doesn't exist" line of defence. I willingly accept that faith is sufficient for some to believe in God, but when someone is willing to claim that he/she *knows* (as opposed to having faith) that "God" exists, as josephw has done here and elsewhere, then a justification, which of course he cannot provide, would be a valid proof of its existence.
If there was proof, then there would be no need for Faith.
That's why there is no proof.
Moreover josephw's case that the universe itself proves "God" is identitical, in structure, to the counter claim that the universe is proof of any other deity I choose to reference or even invent on the spot.
Originally posted by AgergIf there was no God, we would not be here. If you will
I acknowledge that, indeed any request on my part for a proof of "God"'s existence I recognise as one that will be taken rhetorically, to illustrate a point, by the person whom I'm speaking to. That said, it's a useful device when hit with the old - "you can't prove God doesn't exist" line of defence. I willingly accept that faith is sufficient for some to bel ...[text shortened]... erse is proof of any other deity I choose to reference or even invent on the spot.
not accept all of creation as proof of God's existence,
I know you will not accept His only begotten Son as proof.
You are in a sorry state.
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Originally posted by RJHindsIf there was no God, we would not be here. If you will
If there was no God, we would not be here. If you will
not accept all of creation as proof of God's existence,
I know you will not accept His only begotten Son as proof.
You are in a sorry state.
not accept all of creation as proof of God's existence,
I know you will not accept His only begotten Son as proof.
You are in a sorry state.
If there had been no Gandalf, we would not be here. If you will not accept all of creation as proof of Gandalf's magical transformation of middle earth into the earth we live in now, I know you will accept Frodo's heroic mission to purge Middle Earth of the one ring as proof.
When Sauron rises again you will be in a very sorry state.