I’m so proud of them boys…

@philokalia said
[quote]The Proud Boys' former leader has been jailed for 22 years for orchestrating the Capitol riot, the longest sentence so far for a ringleader of the raid on the seat of American democracy.

Henry "Enrique" Tarrio was convicted of seditious conspiracy, a US Civil War-era charge, and other counts in May.



Tarrio, 39, was not in Washington during the riot, but he ...[text shortened]... clear and obvious double standard.

Which shows further just what a kangaroo court we are facing.

"No justice/no peace" doesn't imply violence at all. It's from a formulation by Martin Luther King, Jr.:

"There can be no justice without peace and there can be no peace without justice." January 14, 1968 at Santa Rita, California. https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2010/08/31/897655/-Forget-Glenn-Remembering-Dr-Martin-Luther-King-Jr-in-his-own-words

Again, glance at the language of the seditious conspiracy statute and it is abundantly clear that Tarrio violated it, as the jury unanimously found beyond a reasonable doubt.

All your lies and simple minded propaganda doesn't change that fact.

@no1marauder said
I think you missed the "peaceably assemble" part.

That is not what Biggs and the other defendants here did.

First, I would like to apologize for showing anger - I felt it was appropriate, though, because this poses a very real threat to destroying one of the only democratic societies in the world. In fact, I fear the society has actually already been destroyed by the actions of the court...

I still think very lowly of your opinions and that they are contradictory and treacherous, and I think it shows a lack of character to have such a massive disconnect between your alleged philosophical values and how you see them enacted, and to be so bought up in partisanhsip as to not see this... But still, I went too far in my words.

Nonetheless, I want you to know: I cannot respect any man's opinion who is such a hypocrite, and all I can do is realize that such words are wasted on someone who completely lacks discernment and the ability to be galvanized to be changed... and to give such a display of anger is also problematic.

To meet the anger and wrath of the neoliberal jurists and oligarchs with anger and wrath is to enter the world and become foolish like them.

I should also probably go back to not posting - it's just not worth it.

Yeah, they fought cops on the protest line, and then they barged into the congressional halls chanting and screaming and hoping to be disruptive as possible.

It would have been a great victory to interrupt the counting of the electoral college votes, sure - in their idea, this could have even given a crucial 12-24 hours resulting in new evidence coming forward...

Nobody can truly think that they could throw a coup d'etat here: occupying congress, unarmed, lol, or "taking everyone hostage at congress..!" but you have no guns or lethal weaponry while the DC police, secret service, and all manner of security are there fully armed... These are a joke of an idea, absolutely nonsense, and it played out as such: a woman was shot to death when she crawled through a window. But, for your political purposes, to put your enemy's in jail, you pretend this is relevant.

@no1marauder said
"No justice/no peace" doesn't imply violence at all. It's from a formulation by Martin Luther King, Jr.:

"There can be no justice without peace and there can be no peace without justice."

... It follows identical logic to "The American people have declared war on you" if interpreted broadly.

If you can't see that, you are not clever, or intellectual integrity.

@philokalia said
... It follows identical logic to "The American people have declared war on you" if interpreted broadly.

If you can't see that, you are not clever, or intellectual integrity.

You're a pathetic clown to interpret MLK's words in such a ridiculous manner.

@no1marauder said
You're a pathetic clown to interpret MLK's words in such a ridiculous manner.

OK, so how do we interpret "no peace?"

It's purely symbolic..?

Now, of course, you know where this is going... So you can respond in advance, if you like.

@philokalia said
First, I would like to apologize for showing anger - I felt it was appropriate, though, because this poses a very real threat to destroying one of the only democratic societies in the world. In fact, I fear the society has actually already been destroyed by the actions of the court...

I still think very lowly of your opinions and that they are contradictory and treacher ...[text shortened]... window. But, for your political purposes, to put your enemy's in jail, you pretend this is relevant.

Don't apologize for being an a**hole; you don't mean it and you know it.

No, our democratic society isn't going to be destroyed by prosecuting criminals who seek to make elections meaningless. You're using 1984 logic though the book is probably a little too complex for you to grasp.

Sorry, there is no hypocrisy in believing that those who try to overthrow a democratic government by violence should be punished while at the same time believing in both A) A democratic government based on respect for Natural Rights; and B) The ultimate right of the People to overthrow a tyranny. Only fanatics like yourself believe violence is justified against a government because you don't like the results of an election.

You keep ignoring that there were over 100,000 people there and that a relative few, those who committed crimes, are being punished. They are not being punished for their views (views undoubtedly shared by the vast majority of those who attended the protest), but for their violent and criminal actions. And these defendants are rightly being severely punished for their violation of a serious criminal offense - one you have offered no plausible defense for their violation of.

@philokalia said
OK, so how do we interpret "no peace?"

It's purely symbolic..?

Now, of course, you know where this is going... So you can respond in advance, if you like.

As MLK did:

"Henry David Thoreau said in his essay on civil disobedience that non-cooperation with evil is as much a moral obligation as is cooperation with good. And I do not plan to cooperate with evil at any point."

He was talking about civil disobedience, not violence.

And he was talking about resistance to mass murder, not being upset that your candidate lost an election.

@no1marauder said
As MLK did:

"Henry David Thoreau said in his essay on civil disobedience that non-cooperation with evil is as much a moral obligation as is cooperation with good. And I do not plan to cooperate with evil at any point."

He was talking about civil disobedience, not violence.

... But Tarrio was talking about literal violence, because he's a terrorist, right?

We know this because he helped organize people to go to Washington DC.

Armed with <no weapons> but maybe <someone had pepper spray>, they planned to do a COUP that would OVERTHROW THE US GOVERNMENT...

We know this because he wrote that 'The American people are at war with YOU, Joe Biden' on Instagram (lol).

We know this because he said he was "enjoying the show" and "do what needs to be done," which can only be interpreted as "overthrow the US government using violence - JOEY, get the PEPPER SPRAY, and OVERTHROW THE US GOVERNMENT" (lol).

The only way that you can believe Tarrio is a terrorist who organized violence is also from January 6th: there is no history of him plotting lethal violence meant to enact political change anywhere, though I wouldn't be surprised if you could see evidence that he planned for his guys to get into a street fight with Antifa, who is always planning to get into a street fight with the Proud Boys.

... If you seriously understand politics this way, you have zero discernment, or zero integrity.

@philokalia said
[quote]The Proud Boys' former leader has been jailed for 22 years for orchestrating the Capitol riot, the longest sentence so far for a ringleader of the raid on the seat of American democracy.

Henry "Enrique" Tarrio was convicted of seditious conspiracy, a US Civil War-era charge, and other counts in May.



Tarrio, 39, was not in Washington during the riot, but he ...[text shortened]... clear and obvious double standard.

Which shows further just what a kangaroo court we are facing.

Playing the world's tiniest violin for you:

Zoom in to see it. A lot.

@no1marauder said
Don't apologize for being an a**hole; you don't mean it and you know it.

No, our democratic society isn't going to be destroyed by prosecuting criminals who seek to make elections meaningless. You're using 1984 logic though the book is probably a little too complex for you to grasp.

Sorry, there is no hypocrisy in believing that those who try to overthrow a democrat ...[text shortened]... on of a serious criminal offense - one you have offered no plausible defense for their violation of.

Nobody did any crime that merits anything like a 5+ year sentence.

... I take that back: theoretically, there were some crimes I haven't heard about that could have been done that I would sit back and asy 'yeah, maybe that is a five year sentence...'

But Joe Biggs, Enrique Tarrio, and Zachary Rehl did nothing at all to merit anything like their respective 15+ year sentences, and these sentences were purely vindictive and gross displays of power designed to poltiically intimidate their enemies and set new tyrannical norms in judicial policy.

It comes from some of these people being literal psychopaths, IMO.

@soothfast said
Playing the world's tiniest violin for you:

Zoom in to see it. A lot.

OK, we agree on the rights of Palestinians. We agree on opposing the oligarchy in the West, and in heavy economic restructuring designed to enhance the communities, not to enhance the wealth of politicians...

Why is it that you are not sympathetic to people who are the victims of tyrannical, baised political persecution...?

It is very unbecoming for someone who is a progressive to just chuckle when their political enemies are the victims of tyranny.

Liberals like No1Marauder can do this - they actually believe in the oligarchy as a democracy, and they do not have credit as dynamic, principled thinkers...

But you have a chance to show me you are a principled thinker instead of dancing with impish delight.

@philokalia said
... But Tarrio was talking about literal violence, because he's a terrorist, right?

We know this because he helped organize people to go to Washington DC.

Armed with <no weapons> but maybe <someone had pepper spray>, they planned to do a COUP that would OVERTHROW THE US GOVERNMENT...

We know this because he wrote that 'The American people are at war with YOU, Jo ...[text shortened]...

... If you seriously understand politics this way, you have zero discernment, or zero integrity.

You quite obviously haven't bothered to look at the indictment nor did you pay any attention to the evidence adduced at trial.

Tarrio was not a passive bystander; he organized the attack and did so with the express purpose of storming the Capitol (his own words) and preventing the certification of the election.

That satisfies all the elements of seditious conspiracy, as well as the other charges he was convicted of Conspiracy to Obstruct an Official Proceeding, Obstruction of an Official Proceeding, Conspiracy to Use Force, Intimidation, or Threats to Prevent Officers of the United States from Discharging Their Duties, etc. etc. https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.228300/gov.uscourts.dcd.228300.855.1.pdf

@philokalia said
OK, we agree on the rights of Palestinians. We agree on opposing the oligarchy in the West, and in heavy economic restructuring designed to enhance the communities, not to enhance the wealth of politicians...

Why is it that you are not sympathetic to people who are the victims of tyrannical, baised political persecution...?

It is very unbecoming for someone who is a ...[text shortened]... ut you have a chance to show me you are a principled thinker instead of dancing with impish delight.

I wouldn't expect a brainless puppet of right wing propaganda to have the slightest understanding of my political philosophy.

And you don't disappoint.

@no1marauder said
You quite obviously haven't bothered to look at the indictment nor did you pay any attention to the evidence adduced at trial.

Tarrio was not a passive bystander; he organized the attack and did so with the express purpose of storming the Capitol (his own words) and preventing the certification of the election.

That satisfies all the elements of seditious conspiracy ...[text shortened]... c. https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.228300/gov.uscourts.dcd.228300.855.1.pdf

So it would not be difficult for you to show us where Tarrio stated that he wanted to use violence against humans to disrupt the proceeding and overthrow the government.

That is the basis of seditious conspiracy and sending someone to jail for 20+ years, right...

I can see how it would also be a crime to try to disrupt "local townhall counting the votes" or "PTA meeting," or, of course, a congressional meeting, but this has been done before:

“Thousands of protesters rushed to the … Capitol Wednesday night, forcing their way through doors, crawling through windows and jamming corridors.” That is how one newspaper described the storming of the Capitol — not the one in Washington last week, but the state Capitol in Madison, Wis., a decade ago.

Back then, thousands of pro-union activists — many bused in from out of state — rampaged through the historic building in an effort to stop a vote on collective bargaining reform legislation. So, when I saw the images of a pro-Trump mob rampaging through the U.S. Capitol last week, my first thought was: What is Scott Walker thinking right now?

“It’s like I’m having PTSD from a decade ago,” the former Republican governor of Wisconsin texted me.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/01/14/democrats-were-occupying-capitols-before-they-were-against-it/

It's unremarkable and unimportant other than showing that you are a gross hypcorite on this.

If you want to produce some real evidence - which woudl be baffling as to why the media decies to put silly IG comments up on Tarrio rather than presenting real evidence of guilt - be my guest.

But it is uninteresting to interact with you when there might be people here who have principle, not just parrot oligarch media.

@philokalia said
So it would not be difficult for you to show us where Tarrio stated that he wanted to use violence against humans to disrupt the proceeding and overthrow the government.

That is the basis of seditious conspiracy and sending someone to jail for 20+ years, right...

I can see how it would also be a crime to try to disrupt "local townhall counting the votes" or "PTA meet ...[text shortened]... nteract with you when there might be people here who have principle, not just parrot oligarch media.

Violence was used against humans, idiot.

And the proceedings were disrupted.

Case closed.