The real Ethnic Cleansing

@Metal-Brain said
You opinions are nonsensical and void of reality. Do you think Jews are the only people that have suffered through genocide? I don't see you empathizing with the people of Rwanda and how nobody gave a damn about them. Who came to their rescue? Not the USA, that is for sure.

And you have a solution of zionism that makes no sense either. First of all, they are surrounde ...[text shortened]... propaganda film about them called "Die Rothschild".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikDaoA4raJ0

===The Rothschilds are largely to blame for German anti-Semitism. ===

Jeez!

Every time I try to have a rational conversation with you, eventually, you resort to something like this.

Someday I'm going to learn my lesson.

@sh76 said
===The Rothschilds are largely to blame for German anti-Semitism. ===

Jeez!

Every time I try to have a rational conversation with you, eventually, you resort to something like this.

Someday I'm going to learn my lesson.

Are you denying a lot of people resented Jewish bankers back then?
That is a historical fact. You have a rational conversation and you want to run away from it because YOU do not want a rational conversation about it.

I am not just picking on Jewish bankers either.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar

Just when I thought I could have an HONEST conversation with you I get the "how dare you bring up the Rothschlds" crap. Who do you think created Israel? How dare you want to talk about Israel and crap on me for bringing up the family that funded Israel! SHAME ON YOU!!!!!!

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/my-family-created-israel-the-rothschilds-and-birth-of-a-nation-8932664

@sh76 said
I imagine you're not going to buy the bulwark against Islamic terrorism argument or the reliable ally and base in the middle east argument, so there's no real point in making them here.

So, I'll just say that the 3 billion dollars a year, which basically all has to be given back to American manufacturers, making the whole program a form of Keynesian economic stimulation, is s ...[text shortened]... sk'ing about it can only come from opposition to the principle of the matter, not the dollar amount.

Israel is largely the reason the US is the target of Islamic terrorism and she's hardly a "reliable ally".

Of course, my principles do object to a nation illegally occupying and oppressing millions of people.

Don't yours?

@no1marauder said
Israel is largely the reason the US is the target of Islamic terrorism and she's hardly a "reliable ally".

Of course, my principles do object to a nation illegally occupying and oppressing millions of people.

Don't yours?

Yes, they do.

They also object to a society that trains its Kindergardeners to kill Jews and launches terror attacks to rape and murder civilians.

That's why I want a fair 2-state solution negotiated by a responsible (probably has to be American) politician (I miss Bill Clinton).

I realize it's not going to happen under Trump or Netanyahu.

Maybe in a few years...

@sh76 said
Yes, they do.

They also object to a society that trains its Kindergardeners to kill Jews and launches terror attacks to rape and murder civilians.

That's why I want a fair 2-state solution negotiated by a responsible (probably has to be American) politician (I miss Bill Clinton).

I realize it's not going to happen under Trump or Netanyahu.

Maybe in a few years...

That Netanyahu refuses to is a good reason to stop subsidizing the occupation and oppression.

@no1marauder said
That Netanyahu refuses to is a good reason to stop subsidizing the occupation and oppression.

Netanyahu is right. You cannot have a 2-state solution to the conflict, when one side is hell-bent on the annihilation of the other side. Hamas and other terrorists organisations have repeatedly said they want to destroy Israel and all of Palestine belongs to them, ie Israel has no place or no nation on that piece of land.

Also there is no common ground for negotiation. Both sides want full control of Jerusalem and the Jews aint giving that up. Finally the Jews need control of the area of Solomons Temple.

The US is a permanent ally of Israel. That not changing.

@no1marauder said
That Netanyahu refuses to is a good reason to stop subsidizing the occupation and oppression.

Netanyahu made a deal with Arafat at Wye in 1998 that could have been a solid interim step towards a 2-state solution (yes, I know he acted like a baby by refusing to shake hands, but that's posturing).

Netanyahu refuses to work on a 2-state solution now because the peace process is dead. There's plenty of blame to go around, but Arafat's walking out of Camp David and Abbas' failure to follow through on Olmert's proposal in 2008 (https://www.cfr.org/articles/abbas-admits-he-said-no-israels-peace-offer) were certainly missed opportunities (I'll blame both sides for the Taba debacle in 2001).

If a politician with moral authority and guts re-started the peace process, it's still possible (though the Palestinians are probably never going to get as good a deal as they spurned in 2000 and 2008) to salvage a 2-state solution.

Taking punitive measures against Israel is not going to make that happen.

@Rajk999 said
Netanyahu is right. You cannot have a 2-state solution to the conflict, when one side is hell-bent on the annihilation of the other side. Hamas and other terrorists organisations have repeatedly said they want to destroy Israel and all of Palestine belongs to them, ie Israel has no place or no nation on that piece of land.

Also there is no common ground for negotiation. ...[text shortened]... control of the area of Solomons Temple.

The US is a permanent ally of Israel. That not changing.

Actually, even under Israeli hegemony, Temple Mount is mainly controlled by Muslims. Jews aren't even allowed up when it's Muslim prayer time.

In the 1990s it appeared for a while that the Palestinians were willing to put their goal of wiping out the Jews on the back burner for a while, anyway. They even voted to take wiping out the Jews out of their charter, IIRC.

The Palestinians should get a state with Ramallah as their capital and encompass most of the WB and Gaza (with a protected road connecting them).

Hopefully, when everyone gets tired of the endless wars, they'll get back to negotiating a deal, though it will obviously be much harder than it would have been in 2000 or 2008.

@sh76 said
Actually, even under Israeli hegemony, Temple Mount is mainly controlled by Muslims. Jews aren't even allowed up when it's Muslim prayer time.

In the 1990s it appeared for a while that the Palestinians were willing to put their goal of wiping out the Jews on the back burner for a while, anyway. They even voted to take wiping out the Jews out of their charter, IIRC.

The Pal ...[text shortened]... negotiating a deal, though it will obviously be much harder than it would have been in 2000 or 2008.

Nope I’ve decided Israel gets the WB sorry

@Metal-Brain said
And how can the people of Gaza be sure the zionists will not genocide their people again?

I haven’t forgotten them I’ve been giving sh76 a hard time about that

@sh76 said
Netanyahu made a deal with Arafat at Wye in 1998 that could have been a solid interim step towards a 2-state solution (yes, I know he acted like a baby by refusing to shake hands, but that's posturing).

Netanyahu refuses to work on a 2-state solution now because the peace process is dead. There's plenty of blame to go around, but Arafat's walking out of Camp David and Abbas' ...[text shortened]... age a 2-state solution.

Taking punitive measures against Israel is not going to make that happen.

That's BS. Netanyahu started a massive expansion of settlements ASAP in the early 2000s precisely to torpedo any chance of a viable two State solution.

No Israeli proposal since they scrapped Oslo was for a true Palestinian State.

I hardly think refusing to keep providing weapons to oppressors is "punitive" in a negative sense.

EDIT: Olmert's proposal was a non-serious one offered by PM who had already announced his intention to resign and would have never passed the Knesset. He wouldn't even hand over his proposed map to Abbas!https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g0dv7rxxvo

@sh76 said
Actually, even under Israeli hegemony, Temple Mount is mainly controlled by Muslims. Jews aren't even allowed up when it's Muslim prayer time.

In the 1990s it appeared for a while that the Palestinians were willing to put their goal of wiping out the Jews on the back burner for a while, anyway. They even voted to take wiping out the Jews out of their charter, IIRC.

The Pal ...[text shortened]... negotiating a deal, though it will obviously be much harder than it would have been in 2000 or 2008.

Lots of good ideas there, but what is going to stop Iran, Hamas and Hezbollah from completing their mission. Regardless of what concessions Israel make, its only a matter of time before the extremists emerge and do another 7/10. Then Israel will go on an even bigger murderous rampage.

There is only one solution ...
One country Israel, and all Arabs are subject to the Jews.

@AThousandYoung said
Nope I’ve decided Israel gets the WB sorry

Israel should take both WB and Gaza and turn those areas into prosperous productive regions. Right now they are backward and breeding terrorists.

@no1marauder said
That's BS. Netanyahu started a massive expansion of settlements ASAP in the early 2000s precisely to torpedo any chance of a viable two State solution.

No Israeli proposal since they scrapped Oslo was for a true Palestinian State.

I hardly think refusing to keep providing weapons to oppressors is "punitive" in a negative sense.

EDIT: Olmert's proposal was a non-s ...[text shortened]... He wouldn't even hand over his proposed map to Abbas!https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g0dv7rxxvo

The year 2000 is around 50 years after the war of independence. After the Arabs fled, the land reverted to the state in 2000, after which the govt can dispose of it and rebuild if they choose.

There were some Arabs who wanted to return, but the Jews are absolutely right in refusing them. Nobody wants a bunch of potential terrorists returning into their country.

@sh76 said
(I thought about using the word "genocide" but I'm going to stay consistent and use the term only with regard to wholesale murder based on ethnicity.)

https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=122277180128085866&set=a.122106895904085866

For those who don't like to click on random urls, this is a chart showing Jewish populations from 1926 and 2026 in 11 Muslim/Arab countries. Ac ...[text shortened]... s - JEWS!) while Israelis, by and large, just want to live in peace.

Therein lies the difference.

it is the greatest unexplained phenomenon of the 20th century. Why indeed would someone move from a country where they are a minority to a country where they can get cheap or free homes/land stolen from the locals and the promise they will now be the oppressors instead of the oppressed.

It is simply baffling. Shocking. Preposterous. Inconceivable!!!!