A test to prove God doesn't exist

shavixmir

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08 Jun '08 06:15

josephw
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08 Jun '08 22:06
Originally posted by scottishinnz
Every theist who has ever existed.
You sound like an extremist now. 😛
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08 Jun '08 22:071 edit
Originally posted by scottishinnz
Yes.

Although this has nothing whatsoever to do with the existence of God.
I agree.

But the Bible sayeth:

"He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love"

Hence, assuming biblical inerrancy, Shavixmir knows God.

Which would be interesting, given that he denies any knowledge of God.

Moreover, anyone who presumes biblical inerrancy--perhaps some people in this forum--would be committed to the position that Shavixmir unknowingly knows God as long as they do not cynically presume that Shavixmir is incapable of love.
josephw
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08 Jun '08 22:07
Originally posted by josephw
Of course. We all love.

Do you think I think atheists are subhuman? I suppose some are, but I know some Christians that are some of the ugliest people you ever want to meet.
Of course. We all love.

Do you think I think atheists are subhuman? I suppose some are, but I know some Christians that are some of the ugliest people you ever want to meet.
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08 Jun '08 22:13
Originally posted by josephw
[b]Of course. We all love.

Do you think I think atheists are subhuman? I suppose some are, but I know some Christians that are some of the ugliest people you ever want to meet.[/b]
Sub-human?

I'm trying to workout what you mean by this term. That some people are less capable of loving, and therefore less human? Or that some people are less important in some way?

(Yes, I know you didn't say that about Shav.)
scottishinnz
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08 Jun '08 22:15
Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole
I agree.

But the Bible sayeth:

"He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love"

Hence, assuming biblical inerrancy, Shavixmir knows God.

Which would be interesting, given that he denies any knowledge of God.

Moreover, anyone who presumes biblical inerrancy--perhaps some people in this forum--would be committed to the position that Sh ...[text shortened]... wingly knows God as long as they do not cynically presume that Shavixmir is incapable of love.
That's true. But biblical inerrancy is quite a big precondition.

I was listening to an ex-minister on Atheist Talk Radio last night (talk radio, even interesting talk radio, is the best way of curing insomnia ever!), who basically claimed that true Christians don't really exist.

Whilst the OT promotes tithing, only about 6% of Christians actually tithe (I'm not sure if that's a US only, or whole world stat, but I can't imagine them being so different). However, Christ went further to say that real followers of his should give everything. The Pope isn't even a real follower of Jesus! Jesus also said not to accumulate worldly goods. Anyone with a savings account, or a 401k, or a pension isn't a real Christian. And Jesus also said, in the sermon on the mount, that not all those who called him Lord would enter heaven, that only those who followed his path would. If, as a Christian you possess worldly goods, or fail to give to anyone what they ask, without question, then you're not a true CHristians.

By the way, Joseph, can I have $100, please?
scottishinnz
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08 Jun '08 22:16
Originally posted by josephw
You sound like an extremist now. 😛
Well, show me your empirical evidence for God! If you have no empirical evidence, then all you have is a hunch.
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09 Jun '08 03:16
Scottishinnz- Why are you so abrasive to every theist here? Did something happen to you early in life for you to be so.....angry with believers? Just curious.
scottishinnz
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09 Jun '08 03:521 edit
Originally posted by chappy1
Scottishinnz- Why are you so abrasive to every theist here? Did something happen to you early in life for you to be so.....angry with believers? Just curious.
I'm intolerant of stupidity in general, and people trying to foist their stupidity on others in specific.

[edit; I don't believe myself to be asking too much, certainly when I review scientific papers I am generally kinder than many of my contemporaries. All I ask of these people is that the same standards are applied to their beliefs that we apply to everything else. Would you trust a doctor who told you to take an un-tested drug? What if he said he has no evidence, yet believes in his heart that it will make you better - would you trust him? Would you call him crazy and dangerous? Relgion and neurosurgeons both mess with people's minds, yet only one is grounded in objective reality.]
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09 Jun '08 04:28
Originally posted by scottishinnz
Well, show me your empirical evidence for God! If you have no empirical evidence, then all you have is a hunch.
There is evidence besides the empirical.
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09 Jun '08 04:51
Originally posted by Conrau K
There is evidence besides the empirical.
But is it unequivocal?
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09 Jun '08 05:04
Originally posted by scottishinnz
But is it unequivocal?
I am not speaking of any evidence in particular. My point is that there is such thing as non-empirical evidence. So when josephw wants to prove God's existence, why do you stipulate that it be empirical?
scottishinnz
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09 Jun '08 05:18
Originally posted by Conrau K
I am not speaking of any evidence in particular. My point is that there is such thing as non-empirical evidence. So when josephw wants to prove God's existence, why do you stipulate that it be empirical?
okay, I'll accept any valid evidence.
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09 Jun '08 06:31
Originally posted by chappy1
Scottishinnz- Why are you so abrasive to every theist here? Did something happen to you early in life for you to be so.....angry with believers? Just curious.
My point is, why can't you just let it be? Have you ever considered that maybe theists and people of faith have possibly experienced something that you haven't? Why is that stupidity? Just because people who are Christian proudly proclaim their faith does not make them stupid or low level thinkers it means they have had a different experience than you have. Please just relax because nothing you say here is going to change anyone who has genuine faith in Jesus to change their minds.
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09 Jun '08 06:34
Originally posted by chappy1
My point is, why can't you just let it be? Have you ever considered that maybe theists and people of faith have possibly experienced something that you haven't? Why is that stupidity? Just because people who are Christian proudly proclaim their faith does not make them stupid or low level thinkers it means they have had a different experience than you hav ...[text shortened]... g you say here is going to change anyone who has genuine faith in Jesus to change their minds.
What about Christians who became atheists? Presumably they have had similar experiences with other Christians and so would be able to discount the possibility that other Christians have a unique access to truth.
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09 Jun '08 06:41
Originally posted by scottishinnz
I'm intolerant of stupidity in general, and people trying to foist their stupidity on others in specific.

[edit; I don't believe myself to be asking too much, certainly when I review scientific papers I am generally kinder than many of my contemporaries. All I ask of these people is that the same standards are applied to their beliefs that we apply ...[text shortened]... neurosurgeons both mess with people's minds, yet only one is grounded in objective reality.]
See that's just the thing, faith cannot be lumped in with everything else because faith is essentially something believed and not seen. I cannot prove to you that I believe God exists so that you believe it nor can you prove to me that He doesn't. Faith is a conviction inside an individual brought upon by the Holy Spirit.

For you to call people of faith stupid is ridiculous. You've just insulted most of the population on earth. You've jumped to too many conclusions with that blanket statement. If I'm like any one of the other theists here it wouldn't matter what you said or tried to prove to me because I know what real Truth is.