Originally posted by sonhouse
What is a dragon?

And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

(Revelation 12:9 NASB)

Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?” The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die! For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

(Genesis 3:1-5 NASB)

Originally posted by RJHinds

And the great [b]dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

(Revelation 12:9 NASB)

Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And ...[text shortened]... s will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

(Genesis 3:1-5 NASB)[/b]

And other mythologies. Show me one, a fossil, or a live one.

Originally posted by sonhouse
And other mythologies. Show me one, a fossil, or a live one.

Kent Hovind was Right all along!

YouTube

Dragon Mystery Fossils

YouTube

Real Dragon remains, Seazoria Dragons discovery confirmed. Utah USA

YouTube

Originally posted by sonship

Could there be a gap of millions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2? No.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7olX8h7Fsk

At 13:17 the speakers make the case that [b]"became" can never be the translation of verb there.

This is technical and cannot be addressed in one post at this time. But the same wording of the hayah is " ...[text shortened]... n to hopeless rebel occurred before [b]"the earth became [ or was ] without form and void" .[/b]

TYPO:

I left out THEM and intended to write:

" And God said, Let Us make man in Our image, ... and let THEM have dominion ..." (1:26) [my emphasis].

Originally posted by sonship
TYPO:

I left out THEM and intended to write:

" [b] And God said, Let Us make man in Our image, ... and let THEM have dominion ..." (1:26) [my emphasis].

[/b]

None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2. So the correct answer to my question is No, No, No, No, No.
😏

Originally posted by RJHinds
None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2. So the correct answer to my question is No, No, No, No, No.
😏

None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2. So the correct answer to my question is No, No, No, No, No.

Your logic is not good enough. Of course we could get into who can make their assertion with the loudest voice.

Rather than who can make the most persistent and loudest assertion with the most smug smile, I have preferred to consider the better biblical interpretation.

And the thought that Eve was the first being Satan deceived seems pretty ludicrous. I am not sure exactly what is left of the teaching of his history after you labor to cover up again the exposed past of the Anointed Cherub and Daystar in order to rid your universe of millions of years.

As I see your viewpoint, sometime after the first day God had a need to throw away a rebellious angel. The garden paradise of Eden ordained for Adam served as a handy trash disposal to discard Satan.

Then, if I get you, Satan worked on the human woman FIRST among all other beings. Then all the angels and demons observed how good it turned out for the human couple Adam and Eve when THEY followed Satan, SO they decided they better throw in their lot with him as well.

Makes no sense.

Originally posted by RJHinds
What day did God create serpents and dragons?

What day did God create serpents and dragons?

If I contemplate when God created certain animals I have to say that Genesis seems to be purposely somewhat obscure.

In chapter two Adam is mentioned as made first (arguably) and THEN all the animals. In chapter one Adam is mentioned AFTER all the animals.

I contemplate this seemingly purposeful paradox and consider what the Holy Spirit is trying to emphasize. And I think that it is this:

In both chapters, all the other living things are under Adam's supervision. In chapter one man alone is said to be made in the image of God and given dominion over all living things. And in chapter two Adam is assigned the managerial task of giving names to all the other creatures.

The discrepancy of WHEN the animals were created is overshadowed to me by the one consistent point. And that point is that MAN is at the pinnacle of this pyramid of life. Man is unique among all the other living things.

Man is connected to them yet superior and assigned authority over all of them, he being in God's image and he being assigned to name and define all of them.

That part is obvious.
When the duck billed platypus was created is not that obvious.

Dragons, I don't know much about unless you are talking about the Komodo Dragon lizard beast that we all know about.

More of a puzzle of WHEN serpents were created is when those demonic locusts from the abyss were created in Revelation 9. Nothing is said about them in Genesis 1 or 2.

I think they are something LEFT OVER from a pre-Adamic age.
Their crowns indicate that they occupied some kind of evil kingship.
Probably they are beings not at all mentioned anywhere else the Bible because they were imprisoned, confined up from an old pre-Adamic age.

This of course would argue for an age of which we know little of before the earth was found seen by the seer as "waste and emptiness" in verse 2.

If you disagree with this then you suggest where you think the demonic locust beings were created on that first week of Genesis 1.

"And the fifth angel trumpeted, and I saw a star out of heaven fallen to the earth, and to him was given the key of the pit of the abyss.

And he opened the pit of the abyss, and smoke went up out of the put lke the smoke of a great furnace ... and out of the smoke came forth locusts to the earth, and to them power was given, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

And it was said to them that they should not harm the grass of the earth or any green thing or any tree, but the men wo do not have t he seal of God on their foreheads.

... And the locusts were like horses prepared for war, and on their heads thre were as it were crowns of gold, and their faces were like faces of men. And they had hair like the hair of women, and their teeth were like the teeth of lions.

... They have a king over them, the angel of the abyss; his name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek he has the name Apollyon." (See Revelation 9)

Nevermind the serpent and the Komodo dragon for the moment, on what day in the Genesis one week were these hideous beings created by God?

Originally posted by RJHinds

None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

I disagree.

As a matter of fact Ussher's way of counting geneologies is also not that reliable. When we compare the geneology of Christ in the book of Matthew, there are gaps according to God's priorities of accounting.

Also David is counted TWICE. He is counted as ENDING one span of 14 generations and beginning another span of 14 generations. So we see that in listing genealogies sometimes God has His own accounting according to His own priorities.

How then can you be so sure you can tally up the exact number of years this way? Technically Matthew is incorrect.

"Thus all the generations from Abraham until David are fourteen generations, and from David until the deportation to Babylon, fourteen generations, and from the deportation to Babylon until the Christ, fourteen generations." (Matt. 1:17)

Technically the counting does not add up unless you account for people being DROPPED out of the geneology and David being counted twice.

Spiritually, with a view to God's accounting, according to God's priorities, we have to take Him for what He said -

14 + 14 + 14 = 42 generations (according to His way of accounting).

And there are gaps in history sometimes as the Holy Spirit reviews history according to His priorities.

Originally posted by sonship

None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2. So the correct answer to my question is No, No, No, No, No.

Your logic is not good enough. Of course we could get into who can make their assertion with the loudest voice.

Rather than who can ...[text shortened]... owed Satan, SO they decided they better throw in their lot with him as well.

Makes no sense.

You say: And the thought that Eve was the first being Satan deceived seems pretty ludicrous.

You apparently do not believe the Holy Bible because the first woman, Eve, is recorded in Genesis as being the first to be deceived by the serpent, the Devil. The apostle Paul also writes the following:

For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.

(1 Timothy 2:13-14 NASB)

Originally posted by sonship

What day did God create serpents and dragons?

If I contemplate when God created certain animals I have to say that Genesis seems to be [b]purposely somewhat obscure.

In chapter two Adam is mentioned as made first (arguably) and THEN all the animals. In chapter one Adam is mentioned AFTER all the animals.

I contemplate t ...[text shortened]... the moment, on what day in the Genesis one week were these hideous beings created by God?[/b]

I asked a very simple question for most students of the scriptures. It seems that you have difficulty concentrating enough to logically answer the question. You seem to just ramble on and on without being able to come to the logical answer.

Originally posted by sonship

None of that matters. What matters is that the text does not allow for a gap of millions or billions of years between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

I disagree.

As a matter of fact Ussher's way of counting geneologies is also not that reliable. When we compare the geneology of Christ in the book of Matthew, there are gaps according to God's p ...[text shortened]... re are gaps in history sometimes as the Holy Spirit reviews history according to His priorities.

The fact that there may be some gaps of a few years in other sections of scripture can not logically amount to millions or billions of years. Anyway it is irrelevant to the fact that it is clear there is no gap in the beginnig creation week because each day is numbered with an account of what happened on each day of those beginning 7 days.

YouTube

Originally posted by RJHinds
[b]You say: And the thought that Eve was the first being Satan deceived seems pretty ludicrous.

You apparently do not believe the Holy Bible because the first woman, Eve, is recorded in Genesis as being the first to be deceived by the serpent, the Devil. The apostle Paul also writes the following:

For it was Adam who was first created, and th ...[text shortened]... eived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.

(1 Timothy 2:13-14 NASB)[/b]

I did not did not object to you teaching that Eve was the first WOMAN deceived. Neither did I object to you teaching that Eve was the first HUMAN deceived.

I objected to you once teaching that Eve was the first CREATURE deceived, which you did teach.

Have you changed your mind about that now upon further consideration?

Originally posted by RJHinds
I asked a very simple question for most students of the scriptures. It seems that you have difficulty concentrating enough to logically answer the question. You seem to just ramble on and on without being able to come to the logical answer.

And I asked YOU a simple question about the creatures in Revelation 9 as to when you think they were created if on that first week.

So why don't you respond in kind ?

As to your simple inquiry about serpents - according to Genesis 1 I would say the sixth day is when -

"And God made the animals of the earth according to their kind and the cattle according to their kind and everything that creeps on the ground according to its kind, and God saw that it was good." (Gen. 1:25)

If I was not clear before this should be clear.
And having said that about the sixth day, I do again add that in Genesis 2 you have a little possible paradox because no animal is mentioned as having been made until man is made.

"And Jehovah God formed from the ground every animal [including the serpents I suppose] of the field and every bird of heaven, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called any living animal, that was its name." (2:19)

So there is a little bit of a paradox as to when the serpent was made, isn't there ?

Dragons, I have no comment on.

Originally posted by RJHinds

The fact that there may be some gaps of a few years in other sections of scripture can not logically amount to millions or billions of years.

It does not prove that there is an interval of long time between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2. But it does demonstrate that Bishop Ussher's counting up years to pinpoint the date of the creation of the universe, using genealogies may not be accurate.

It is a contributing factor to us not assuming dogmatically we know when "the beginning" was in terms of a date.

Anyway it is irrelevant to the fact that it is clear there is no gap in the beginning [edited] creation week because each day is numbered with an account of what happened on each day of those beginning 7 days.

It is clear to some of us that the earth was waste and void, which combination of words elsewhere in the Bible are indicative of a divine overthrow in judgment.

What happened?
It the details are not provided in Genesis they are provided elsewhere when God wants to provide them.

We believe that "elsewhere" includes Isaiah 14:12-15 and Ezekiel 28:12-17. At that time the curtain is pulled back and we see the history of Satan.

We see his sin against God's holiness in the Ezekiel passage.
And we see the sin against God's authority in the Isaiah passage.

Now you, I hope, will inform me if you still believe that Eve was the first CREATURE that Satan deceived. (If you have not yet)

Originally posted by sonship
And I asked YOU a simple question about the creatures in [b]Revelation 9 as to when you think they were created if on that first week.

So why don't you respond in kind ?

As to your simple inquiry about serpents - according to Genesis 1 I would say the sixth day is when -

"And God made the animals of the earth according to their ki ...[text shortened]... of a paradox as to when the serpent was made, isn't there ?

Dragons, I have no comment on.

Sea serpents are identified as being created on the fifth day and all land serpents were created on the sixth day before mankind. Dragons is just another name for the more fearsome serpent beasts. So the answer is the 5th and 6th day.

Revelation 9 is a vision and there is no need to say when those creatures were created. However, if we assume that these are real physical creatures, then we should also assume they are created on the 5th and 6th day of creation. 😏