04 May 15
Originally posted by robbie carrobieRobbie, even I have to say that you are the single biggest dork on this site. In fact, even in a room crowded with dorks, such as this thread, you are the single biggest dork of them all.
Neither True, Nor False, But Meaningless
A further drastic problem arises if the atheist wishes to claim that his statement “there is no God” is not a claim or a belief—if it isn’t, then it cannot be true or false. The problem is that only claims can be true or false. It makes perfect sense to ask whether a claim like “It is raining today” or “The ...[text shortened]... ng accordingly.
http://www.rzim.eu/the-scandanavian-sceptic-or-why-atheism-is-a-belief-system
Originally posted by SuzianneIf you came into the presence of the greatest chess bomb since Bobby Fischer you'd go all girly on me and be like wow robbie you 2awesome and I'd have to agree. Robbie like a chess explosion man!
Robbie, even I have to say that you are the single biggest dork on this site. In fact, even in a room crowded with dorks, such as this thread, you are the single biggest dork of them all.
04 May 15
Originally posted by robbie carrobieMy atheism is true. Atheism is defined as a lack of belief in gods. I have a lack of belief in gods. There is no other way around it. There is not even a tiny bit of god belief in my body. There is simply an utter absence of it. Hence, I am an atheist. By definition. Not because I want it, or need it, or because it comforts me, or brings me hope and joy, or because I've thought about it a lot. Simply because I lack a belief in gods.
On the other hand, if the atheist wishes to claim that his atheism is true, then that must mean that atheism is a claim, and claims need to be defended, evidence provided and reasons given.
If you have difficulty understanding this, then let me know.
Originally posted by Great King RatOh I'm not having any difficulty with your claim, I am simply having difficulty finding any valid reason for it.
My atheism is true. Atheism is defined as a lack of belief in gods. I have a lack of belief in gods. There is no other way around it. There is not even a tiny bit of god belief in my body. There is simply an utter absence of it. Hence, I am an atheist. By definition. Not because I want it, or need it, or because it comforts me, or brings me hope and j ...[text shortened]... because I lack a belief in gods.
If you have difficulty understanding this, then let me know.
04 May 15
Belief Leads to Action
A third problem with the idea that atheism is not a claim or belief, but merely the absence of belief in God, is that absences possess no causative power. If I drop a sledgehammer on my foot, it will cause pain. Touching the screen on your iPod may cause an Abba track to play through your headphones. But a non-existent sledgehammer or non-existent iPod causes nothing (in the case of Abba songs, much to the relief of lovers of music everywhere).
When it comes to beliefs, much the same applies. Non-belief in the tooth fairy does not cause action (it might arguably cause non-action, such as not putting your teeth under the pillow when they fall out.[5]) For something to cause an action, it has to be a positive belief, an actual claim.
So what about atheism? It doesn’t take a lot of searching to quickly discover that atheism does indeed cause actions. For example, many Internet-dwelling atheists read sceptical websites, edit Wikipedia articles, frequent atheist discussion forums, and post anti-religious sound bites on Twitter. These are all actions, caused, one would imagine, by their atheism. Likewise, it was his atheism that caused Richard Dawkins to write his best-selling book The God Delusion and, presumably, atheism that led many enthusiastic young sceptics to buy it, causing if not much rejoicing in heaven, certainly much celebration in the North Oxford branch of whoever Dawkins banks with. For a non-belief, a non-thing, atheism looks rather busy and active and so we must be suspicious of anybody telling us atheism is nothing.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieTheism causes a lot of harm in the world. It is good that there are people standing up to this.
Belief Leads to Action
A third problem with the idea that atheism is not a claim or belief, but merely the absence of belief in God, is that absences possess no causative power. If I drop a sledgehammer on my foot, it will cause pain. Touching the screen on your iPod may cause an Abba track to play through your headphones. But a non-existent sledg ...[text shortened]... ks rather busy and active and so we must be suspicious of anybody telling us atheism is nothing.
Originally posted by Great King RatWith something other than a subjective belief otherwise if you claim that you were a world war i flying ace that flew beside the Red Baron i should be expected to believe that claim as true as well.
It is true that I lack a belief in gods and that is defined as atheism. That is true. In what way should I support this?
04 May 15
Originally posted by Great King Ratthe Khmer Rouge killed hundreds of thousands trying to establish an atheist state and Hitler was profoundly influenced by social Darwinism and used it as a pretext for war. Its probably true that Stalin was a closet atheist as well despite giving the impression of piety, he certainly tore down enough churches. And old Mao and the atheistic communists in China, I forget just how many persons they managed to either directly or indirectly kill but they sure made the meanest medieval crusader look like a pansy in comparison.
Theism causes a lot of harm in the world. It is good that there are people standing up to this.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieSo you don't believe that I lack a believe in gods. That's alright. I'm not particulary interested in proving you that I do or do not believe this or that. I also wouldn't know how to do that, other than hooking up some wires to my brain and do some kind of test.
with something other than a subjective belief otherwise if you claim that you were a world war i flying ace that flew beside the Red Baron i should be expected to believe that claim as true as well.
How would you suggest I prove to you, on this website, that I lack a belief in gods?
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYes, let's make sure that never happens again.
the Khmer Rouge killed hundreds of thousands trying to establish an atheist state and Hitler was profoundly influenced by social Darwinism and used it as a pretext for war. Its probably true that Stalin was a closet atheist as well despite giving the impression of piety, he certainly tore down enough churches. And old Mao and the atheistic communists ...[text shortened]... ndirectly kill but they sure made the meanest medieval crusader look like a pansy in comparison.
Likewise, let's make sure that in 20 years from now there are no more people who refuse for their children to have bloodtransfusions because of a religious belief system. You with me?
04 May 15
Originally posted by Great King RatBut you have made a claim? and a truth claim at that! Don't you want to substantiate your claim? How do you expect others to believe you without substantiation? Does that seem logical, reasonable to you?
So you don't believe that I lack a believe in gods. That's alright. I'm not particulary interested in proving you that I do or do not believe this or that. I also wouldn't know how to do that, other than hooking up some wires to my brain and do some kind of test.
How would you suggest I prove to you, on this website, that I lack a belief in gods?
I don't know how you could go about it, its your claim. You might start with something like, I profess atheism because I cannot understand why a loving God would permit so much suffering. Or I am an atheist because I cannot accept the violence that has been perpetrated in the name of religion, something like that.
Originally posted by Great King RatWow a cheap shot. You know practically nothing about about the state of medical science and the alternatives that are now available, but don't let your ignorance get in the way. In fact you might be interested to know that there are entire hospitals dedicated to bloodless surgery. So no I am not with you and infact I am about as far removed from you as is diametrically possible.
Yes, let's make sure that never happens again.
Likewise, let's make sure that in 20 years from now there are no more people who refuse for their children to have bloodtransfusions because of a religious belief system. You with me?