Angels

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
The New world translation undergoes constant revision, now why don't you make reference to the text that has already been given?

The Word of God doesn't need to be revised except to correct misspellings and other such typographical errors.

The KJV has only undergone ten revisions in four hundred years to the best of my knowledge.

But of course they started with the right manuscripts in the first place.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
citing similar renderings of the text does nothing to explain the original language for all you are asking us to do is compare texts that are already translated, its deceitful, impotent and rather predictable. Now why don't you tell us why the term suddenly becomes an act of worship where Jesus is concerned but not an act of worship in other places ...[text shortened]... the religious bias of your translators being exposed, well, its nothing more than they deserve.

προσκυνέω
Transliteration: proskyneō
Pronunciation: pros-kü-ne'-ō
Part of Speech: verb
Root Word (Etymology): from G4314 and a probable derivative of G2965 (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand)
Outline of Biblical Usage:
to kiss the hand to (towards) one, in token of reverence
among the Orientals, esp. the Persians, to fall upon the knees and touch the ground with the forehead as an expression of profound reverence
in the NT by kneeling or prostration to do homage (to one) or make obeisance, whether in order to express respect or to make supplication
used of homage shown to men and beings of superior rank
to the Jewish high priests
to God
to Christ
to heavenly beings
to demons
KJV Translation Count:
60 Total worship 60

The Greek word proskyneō is always translated as worship in the KJV because that's what it means.

Why do you keep kicking against the goads robbie?

Originally posted by josephw
προσκυνέω
Transliteration: proskyneō
Pronunciation: pros-kü-ne'-ō
Part of Speech: verb
Root Word (Etymology): from G4314 and a probable derivative of G2965 (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand)
Outline of Biblical Usage:
to kiss the hand to (towards) one, in token of reverence
among the Orientals, esp. the Persians, to fall upon the ...[text shortened]... ip in the KJV because that's what it means.

Why do you keep kicking against the goads robbie?

you own text refutes your silly claim. Tell us why in some places its rendered as bow down, do obeisance etc and yet when it comes to Jesus it suddenly becomes worship because contrary to your ludicrous claims and your own text that is not what it means.

Originally posted by josephw
The Word of God doesn't need to be revised except to correct misspellings and other such typographical errors.

The KJV has only undergone ten revisions in four hundred years to the best of my knowledge.

But of course they started with the right manuscripts in the first place.

Really? Can you tell us what original manuscripts the King James was based on? You have stated they were the right ones, so tell us what they were and how you know they were the right ones?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
you own text refutes your silly claim. Tell us why in some places its rendered as bow down, do obeisance etc and yet when it comes to Jesus it suddenly becomes worship because contrary to your ludicrous claims and your own text that is not what it means.

Does it?

Strong's Number 4352 matches the Greek προσκυνέω (proskyneō), which occurs 65 times in 54 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV

Looks like that Greek word is translated "worship" most every time. How can you say my own text refutes that? 🙄

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Really? Can you tell us what original manuscripts the King James was based on? You have stated they were the right ones, so tell us what they were and how you know they were the right ones?

What's the matter? Don't you know?

You know as well as I that the NWT is translated from a different text as from the KJV.

Having that Watchtower New World Translation in my home has the exact same feel as having a statue of Mary or an idol of Jesus on a cross in my home.

My spirit just rejects its presence period. Both make me feel rather sick within just to be around them.

Originally posted by josephw
Does it?

Strong's Number 4352 matches the Greek προσκυνέω (proskyneō), which occurs 65 times in 54 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV

Looks like that Greek word is translated "worship" most every time. How can you say my own text refutes that? 🙄

because you provided the definition of the term, duh?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Here is an accurate translation free from religious bais ....

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102000250?q=Hebrews+1%3A6&p=par#h=16

Your allegedly "religiously unbiased" accurate translation is from your own Jehovah's Witness website... 😕

Originally posted by josephw
What's the matter? Don't you know?

You know as well as I that the NWT is translated from a different text as from the KJV.

because you made the claim that is why it matters, you have stated that the King James version used the correct manuscripts, so we shall ask you again, what were those manuscripts and how do you know they were correct.

I suspect Joseph that you have really no idea on what the King James version was based and even less idea how you know they were correct, so here is your chance otherwise we shall be forced to conclude that you have not the slightest idea what you are talking about.

So tell us on what manuscripts the King James was based and how you know they are the correct ones. I have not mentioned the New world translation and your inclusion of it is irrelevant.

Originally posted by sonship
Having that Watchtower New World Translation in my home has the exact same feel as having a statue of Mary or an idol of Jesus on a cross in my home.

My spirit just rejects its presence period. Both make me feel rather sick within just to be around them.

yeah why don't you wear garlic around your neck and approach it with a silver cross? As you reach for it make sure you have a wooden stake with which to drive through its cover.

I suspect its because you're the latter ones mentioned by the apostle Paul,

For to God we are a sweet fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing to the latter ones an odor of death leading to death, to the former ones a fragrance of life leading to life. 2 Corinthians 2:14

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
you own text refutes your silly claim. Tell us why in some places its rendered as bow down, do obeisance etc and yet when it comes to Jesus it suddenly becomes worship because contrary to your ludicrous claims and your own text that is not what it means.

Surely that is back to front Robbie? Why do you only translate it as obeisance when it relates to Jesus?

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
' (NWT) In the 1970 edition, Heb. 1:6 is translated as the word "worship." In the 1980 version it is translated as 'obeisance.' Why the change?

The Jehovah's Witness will probably answer this issue the same way he would with the false prophecies made by the Watchtower Magazine. He would say that "the light is getting brighter." This means that ...[text shortened]... s believing now won't be changed later?'

https://carm.org/heb-16-let-angels-do-obeisance-him

robbie carrobie and Galveston75 have played that card before and it was debunked then by another informed poster who's name escapes me.

I'm not sure if robbie has addressed another point in another thread (probably not as I am on his pout list at the moment) - where I asked if the "angel of the Lord" you he was claiming was Jesus to support his angel argument, was actually more likely to be Jehovah, seeing as LORD in the OT refers to Jehovah.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Surely that is back to front Robbie? Why do you only translate it as obeisance when it relates to Jesus?

You have proof of course that we translate it exclusively as obeisance with reference to Jesus and worship every where else? No then what are you talking about?

All the angels of God worship Him

Strong's Greek Dictionary #4352 - worship

Same Greek word used in -

" I fell down to worship before the feet ..." (Rev. 22:8)
"... worship God " (Rev. 22:9)

" If any man worship the beast and his ..." (Rev. 14:9)
" ... who worship the beast and his image" (Rev. 14:11)

" .. the place where men ought to worship" (John 4:20)

" worship Him that lives forever and ever " (Rev. 4:10)

"shall come and worship before You" (Rev. 15:4)

"shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth" (John 4:24)

"the Father seeks such to worship Him" (John 4:23)

All these and many more are passages using the same Greek word as for Hebrews 1:6 - "And let all the angels of God worship Him" [the Firstborn Son]