Calling Out Jesus in Rev.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Apologies. I thought, back then, you would have been in your teenage years.

You sound so silly goad! 😛

-VR

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Do you recall when Jesus said, 'The Father is greater than I'?

Yes

And my question to you?

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

Do you recall when Jesus said, 'The Father is greater than I'?

That is John 14:28.

You have heard that I said to you, I go away, and I am coming to you. If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced that I go to the Father,

for the Father is greater than I." (John 14.28)

That's not the only verse in John.

Christ was the Word Who was God (John 1:1) and became in a form that He could die (John 1:14). When the Bible says that the Son is God (John 1:1; Heb. 1:8) it is not meaning that He did not become a man.

"And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us."

God was incarnated to be the mingling of God and man. Speaking on the ground of His humanity He is SENT by God. Surely He can say the sending Father to Whom He is in utter subjection and obedience "is greater than I".

Man is a creature. The Creator is greater than any creature.
The Word Who was God from eternity took upon Himself creation and was incarnated. "And the Word became flesh ...". God became a man.

Standing on that ground the Son of God said that Father was greater than He.

His going and coming is a matter of Him dying for us in utter obedience to His Father and coming again to us in RESURRECTION. He has to be a man to do that.

In the same chapter in verse 18 He speaks of His coming to mean His resurrection. And in resurrection He comes to us as the Spirit.

"Even the Spirit of reality, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold HIm or know Him; but you know Him, because He abides with you and shall be in you. (v.17)

I will not leave you orphans, I am coming to you. (v.18)

Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer, but you behold Me; because I live, you shall live also. " (v.19)

As a man He can go to the cross and die and come again to us in resurrection to live within man as the Spirit of reality, the "another Comforter" . To be a man to die and rise He speaks in obedience and in being sent, that the Father is greater than He.

BY saying Christ is God we do not mean that He is not also a man.

Incarnating as an obedience man He can be among the disciples. Resurrecting and become the indwelling life giving Spirit He can be IN the disciples. He dies to redeem us and resurrects to come to live within us.

His coming in resrurrection to live in His lovers is His coming with the Father as the Divine "We" of the Father and the Son AS the Holy Spirit.

It is in the same chapter 14 back in verse 23.

Jesus answered and said to him, If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word, and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make an abode with him." (v.23)

One aspect of the total truth is that the Father is greater than He (John 14:28). Another aspect of the total truth is that He and His greater Father are one. (John 10:30)

And I give them eternal life, and they shall by no means perish forever, and no one shall snatch them out of My hand. (v.28)

My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all, and no one can snatch them out of My Father's hand. (v.29)

I and the Father are one." (v.30)

I was hoping for a little more. 🙁

@kellyjay said
I was hoping for a little more. 🙁

That's why God gave us sonship.

Christ Humbled Himself in Seven stages thus making His words "the Father is greater than I" consistent with His steps of humbling. Count the steps carefully below.

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus,

Who existing in the form of God, did not consider being equal with God a treasure to be grasped, (v.6)
But emptied Himself, taking the form of a slave, becoming in the likeness of men; (v.7)
And being found in fashion as a man, He humbled Himself, becoming obedient even unto death, and that the death of a cross. (v.8)

Therefore also God highly exalted Him and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, (v.9) That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven and on earth and under the earth.(v.10), And every tongue should openly confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father. (v.11) (Phil. 2:5-11)

"the Father is greater than I " because -

1.) He did not regard equality with God a thing to cling to or retain as a treasure to be grasped.
2.) He laid aside the form of God, His possession.
3.) He emptied Himself of this glory in taking the form of a slave.
4.) His divine nature was not put away but His outward expression became that of a man.
5.) He became an entirely obedient man.
6.) His obedience was unto His death.
7.) The death was the most shameful, humiliating, and tormenting death - "the death of a cross"

@ghost-of-a-duke said
That's why God gave us sonship.

Okay that was funny 😉 in a good way!

@sonship said
Christ Humbled Himself in Seven stages thus making His words "the Father is greater than I" consistent with His steps of humbling. Count the steps carefully below.

[quote] Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus,

Who existing in the form of God, did not consider being equal with God a treasure to be grasped, (v.6)
But emptied Himself, taking th ...[text shortened]... ) The death was the most shameful, humiliating, and tormenting death - "the death of a cross"

Jesus did humble Himself for the glory of God to save our self righteous sinful
souls. Our salvation is found not in us but in Him, so God gets the glory for our
turning to Him, we cannot claim anything about us that we can take pride in. The
prideful miss this as they attempt to be worthy, or claim to be worthy as they go
to God, as if they can make God love them, or make God forgive them. We too
have to humble ourselves before God as we come, and acknowledge our faults
and accept the gift of God's grace and mercy. It will be for God's glory we are
saved not our own.