Originally posted by orfeoEither way, what you are reporting is coincidence.
1. I had no idea what was going on. The friend in question lives thousands of kilometres away in another country. And it seemed incredibly important that I write in my blog, so yes, I regard God as having told me what to say.
2. The room was full of Christians - I was at church! As usual, you're missing the point. The praying wasn't the point. WHAT was ...[text shortened]... dingly obvious and has already been discussed without your particular brand of venom attached.
Nothing more...nothing less.
It is no more proof of God than the fact that by many billions to one against all probability we are both here having this discussion.
Originally posted by CodfishI never made any of these claims.
Everyone who is not an atheist is a brainwashed fool?
Everyone who disagrees with you is also a brainwashed fool?
The founders of religions were crazy? (i.e. Jesus, Siddhartha, Mohammad.)
Mr. Gee, its almost like you want to be verbally abused by everybody on this forum.
P.S. I took some liberties with my third statement, but I can't imagine that Howard would disagree with it. After all, he isn't a brainwashed fool.
Halitosis is certainly a brain washed fool, however...just like you.
Originally posted by orfeoDo you acknowledge that had you been a Muslim, you would have 'experienced' Allah holding your hands?
1. I had no idea what was going on. The friend in question lives thousands of kilometres away in another country. And it seemed incredibly important that I write in my blog, so yes, I regard God as having told me what to say.
2. The room was full of Christians - I was at church! As usual, you're missing the point. The praying wasn't the point. WHAT was ...[text shortened]... dingly obvious and has already been discussed without your particular brand of venom attached.
1 edit
Originally posted by orfeoSo let me get this straight - you offer 3 examples of when you have experienced God, then deny that these experiences are good evidence for God's existence.
Hey, who do you think he is agreeing with? [b]I never said they constituted good evidence for God's existence![/b]
Usually when we experience some thing, then unless we think we are hallucinating due to sleep deprivation, drug usage, etc, we count this as good evidence for said thing's existence.
Are you admitting that your experiences are unreliable, and that they are not experiences of God, but just a result of expectation induced pyschosis?
Originally posted by howardgeeI'm admitting that, while I consider them evidence, they aren't likely to be 'objectively' considered to be particularly compelling.
So let me get this straight - you offer 3 examples of when you have experienced God, then deny that these experiences are good evidence for God's existence.
Usually when we experience some thing, then unless we think we are hallucinating due to sleep deprivation, drug usage, etc, we count this as good evidence for said thing's existence.
Are you admi ...[text shortened]... and that they are not experiences of God, but just a result of expectation induced pyschosis?
Some people become Christians on the basis of one, single dramatic 'Road to Damascus' experience. I am simply saying that I was not one of them. Nor am I going to be able to provide you with one particular miraculous event that I took part in (although I've heard of a few second-hand) that cannot be explained away. And you wouldn't be happy with the second-hand accounts, judging by your attitude to the Bible.
My experience instead has been a cumulative one. Any one event can be put down to coincidence or imagination. But either the world is full of more incredible coincidences than I could have imagined, or I hallucinate a lot more frequently than I expected, or some of this stuff is real.
1 edit
Originally posted by HalitoseSeeing, hearing, touching, smelling or tasting God and having somebody else sense him in the same way alongside me (Just like anything else you are not sure of).
Back to my original question which as yet stands unanswered: What would you accept as good evidence?!!
Now answer my question:
So, do you agree that Orfeo's examples constitute good evidence for God's existence? (because he doesn't).
Originally posted by orfeoSo you don't even trust your own senses!
I'm admitting that, while I consider them evidence, they aren't likely to be 'objectively' considered to be particularly compelling.
Some people become Christians on the basis of one, single dramatic 'Road to Damascus' experience. I am simply saying that I was not one of them. Nor am I going to be able to provide you with one particular miraculous event t ...[text shortened]... , or I hallucinate a lot more frequently than I expected, or some of this stuff is real.
Small wonder you cling desperately to the lifeboat of the bible and religion in your own sad, uncertain world of Cartesian doubt.
Originally posted by Codfishhe said:
Are you misinterpreting what he says on purpose, or do you just not understand what he is saying?
"But either the world is full of more incredible coincidences than I could have imagined, or I hallucinate a lot more frequently than I expected, or some of this stuff is real."
Every single one of my experiences, I am certain of. I do not wonder if I was hallucinating, or of they were just coincidences, or whatever.
Thus he is unsure of his experiences.
Do you know what Cartesian doubt is?
1 edit
Originally posted by howardgeeGod is fiction.
That's all I ask.
If I believed in the Flying Spaghetti monster, then in order for you to dispute my claim, I would have to define what I thought it was.
Please be as specific as you can; try and avoid vagueness.
So come on all ye faithful - describe for me what it is you worship.
Only the Flying Spaghetti Monster is real.
1 edit
Originally posted by howardgee"But either the world is full of more incredible coincidences than I could have imagined, or I hallucinate a lot more frequently than I expected, or some of this stuff is real."
he said:
"But either the world is full of more incredible coincidences than I could have imagined, or I hallucinate a lot more frequently than I expected, or some of this stuff is real."
Every single one of my experiences, I am certain of. I do not wonder if I was hallucinating, or of they were just coincidences, or whatever.
Thus he is unsure of his experiences.
Do you know what Cartesian doubt is?
I am pretty sure he doesn't doubt his own senses.
I think this post means that because he knows that he is not hallucinating and some incidents are impossible to believe as coincidinces, the only option left is the third one.