Direct Response to ThinkOfOne

Originally posted by sonship

As I've repeatedly told you:
"In John 8:31-36, Jesus states that His true disciples will be made free from committing sin. That those who are not made free will not 'remain in the house forever'".

Have you ever read that He is able set His saved before Himself without blemish ?

[b]" But to Him who is able to guard you from stumb ...[text shortened]... us into all the truth - this learning the truth is a process of maturation, growth, development.

C'mon jaywill. you keep avoiding directly addressing the following:
"In John 8:31-36, Jesus states that His true disciples will be made free from committing sin. That those who are not made free will not 'remain in the house forever'". Jesus' true disciples will no longer commit sin. Those who continue to commit sin will not 'remain in the house forever', i.e., will not have eternal life.

Instead you keep emphasizing "Christ the atoner" which Kierkegaard pointed out is "the religion of Paul" which is "just the opposite of the original proclamation of Christ". In the teachings of Jesus, His followers must be transformed from a "bad tree" to a "good tree" - from a "slave" to a "son" in order to have "eternal life" / "heaven" / "salvation".

Originally posted by KingOnPoint
ThinkOfOne,
Christ spoke to Nicodemus in John 3 about needing to be born again. Christ, another time, taught to repent and be baptized. Christ said more than one thing during his life. Christ told another man to follow Him. It is Christ that is the center for salvation, not doing good works.

Will you put faith in Christ Jesus for your salvation?
Read John 3: 10-18, and if you will, even read John 3: 1-18

I'm quite familiar with what Jesus said in John 3. It ties in quite well with what Jesus taught in John 8:31-36. Those who continue to commit sin remain "born of the flesh". Those who no longer commit sin have been "born of the spirit". Just as the "slave does not remain in the house forever" and "the son does remain forever", so it is that "...unless one is born of...the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. .”

To KoP,

Please address the following in an open, honest and forthright manner. Or do you lack the integrity to do so? If you lack the integrity to do so, then I see no point in trying to continue this discussion.

As for ThinkOfOne, he needs to use the Greek language that part of the bible was written in to understand what the English language doesn't show in detail.

Let's look again at the following verse:
John 8
Jesus answered them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin.

Let's look again at what you had to say about it:
"One thing that I have been taught is that 'committing sin' as meant in part of the bible doesn't mean 'never sinning,' but it means not sinning 'as a way of life.'"

Let's look again at what YOU posted about what the Greek says:
...."committeth" is in the Present Tense(Occuring in Time), Active Voice, and Participle Mood
...............I. to make
..............II. to do

Let's look again at what I posted about this:
"In short, Jesus was saying that EVERYONE who 'makes' or 'does' sin is a slave to sin - not just those who sin 'as a way of life'. And that His true disciples will be made free from 'making' or 'doing' sin."

Clearly YOU'RE the one who is ignoring what the Greek language says. Why the dishonesty?

AND

Also, ThinkOfOne needs to accept all that Christ said, and not just John 8: 31-36.

Your characterization that the only thing that I accept about what Jesus said is John 8:31-36 is misleading. Again, why the dishonesty?

Four pages of Christians arguing over such hair-splitting points MUST be some kind of record. Or maybe not 😉

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
Four pages of Christians arguing over such hair-splitting points MUST be some kind of record. Or maybe not 😉

Not even close!

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
Four pages of Christians arguing over such hair-splitting points MUST be some kind of record. Or maybe not 😉

Hair-splitting point? The subtext is that of "salvation though righteousness" vs. "salvation by faith alone". Jesus taught the former.

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
Four pages of Christians arguing over such hair-splitting points MUST be some kind of record. Or maybe not 😉

These points are of interest to Christians and the point in question is not "hair-splitting".

What's possibly more interesting is why you, an atheist, are here reading "four pages of Christians arguing over hair-splitting points". If it's so uninteresting and so unimportant I suggest you go get a life elsewhere and get on with it.

Blessings.

Originally posted by divegeester
These points are of interest to Christians and the point in question is not "hair-splitting".

What's possibly more interesting is why you, an atheist, are here reading "four pages of Christians arguing over hair-splitting points". If it's so uninteresting and so unimportant I suggest you go get a life elsewhere and get on with it.

Blessings.

What leads you to conclude that PinkFloyd is an atheist? If my memory serves me correctly, PinkFloyd is a Christian.

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
Four pages of Christians arguing over such hair-splitting points MUST be some kind of record. Or maybe not 😉

I totally concur.

ThinkOfOne
You Added
---------------------
Also, ThinkOfOne needs to accept all that Christ said, and not just John 8: 31-36.

Your characterization that the only thing that I accept about what Jesus said is John 8:31-36 is misleading. Again, why the dishonesty?
----------------------

I don't want to be dishonest. You demanded to me that I only respond on John 8: 31-36 and/or Ezekiel 33 no matter what I typed before starting a response. I cannot tell from your demand that what I typed meant anything to you before I typed on John 8: 30-34. If you are saying that what I type is irrelevant, then what other conclusion should I draw if you don't accept other bible passages?

PinkFloyd,
The problem is not over split-hairs, the problem is about how a person is saved with God. A man cannot be saved by doing good works. A man can be saved by Christ, the Savior.

A person who tries to do good works and expects to saved by them, is deceived. Therefore it is crucial to know how a person is saved. Those who depend on being good enough to earn heaven will not make it on that criteria.

ThinkOfOne,
Jesus did not teach that a person is saved through doing good works. It does seem to say in Luke 10 that if an Israelite can keep the Law of God, not the law of Christ, then that Israelite will live. However, I ask you this, who in the world other than Christ has kept the whole Law of God? Have you kept it? Do you keep only the law of Christ?

The law of Christ does not bring eternal life. It is a matter of obedience. The person who is saved is saved because Christ makes that believer a son of God, an heir with Christ. Obedience to Christ's Commands does not make a person good enough for heaven.

That is why Jesus shed His blood, took our sins on Himself, died to satisfy God's punishment for sin, and rose again.

He made a way for the punishment of our sins to be removed from us and a way for us to live with eternal life. The removal of sin from a Christian isn't because that Christian doesn't sin anymore. Furthermore, a Christian will not be free of the sin nature until either human death or until Christ catches up his believers.

Salvation is a gift and will never be anything else for a Christian.

If you think that you never sin, then that is sad. Jesus told Peter to forgive his brother multiple times. That includes Christians. If Christians don't sin, then why do they need to be forgiven multiple times? If you are already a Christian, and you don't confess your daily sins against God so that you will be forgiven for those individual sins, then you cannot say that you are forgiven for those sins yet.

If I remember right, it is put in one of the Psalms.
"If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me."

So, if David did not sin, how can he be regarding iniquity in his heart? After he committed adultery, he admitted that he had sinned, and Nathan, I guess, said that David will not die.

King James Version
================
Matthew 6: 14
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

And also, the Lord Jesus told people how to pray which included asking God to forgive us as we forgive others.

King James Version
=================
Matthew 18: 21, 22
Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?

Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.