DIvine Seed

Originally posted by sonship

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23 KJV)

nothing to do with regeneration

It has to do with regeneration or born again. Its PAST TENSE. It pertains to BEFORE the millennial kingdom in the church age.

And Peter, on this side of the ...[text shortened]... d [b]regeneration in Matthew 19:28 is a different Greek word.

www.regenerated.net[/b]

Do the research yourself.

Your false translation in Peter is from a Greek word 'to beget as in 1 Peter

1Pet 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

BEGOTTON US.... Used 5 times in Peter.

Regeneration is not in the book of Peter.

Past tense, past tense, past tense (or continuing in the present still) on THIS side of the millennial restoration.

NET Bible
You have been born anew, not from perishable but from imperishable seed, through the living and enduring word of God.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
As persons who have been born again, not from fallible seed, but that which is infallible, by the living word of God which stands for eternity.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
You have been born again , not from a seed that can be destroyed, but through God's everlasting word that can't be destroyed. That's why [Scripture says],

New American Standard 1977
for you have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and abiding word of God.

Jubilee Bible 2000
being born again , not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which lives and abides for ever.

King James 2000 Bible
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which lives and abides forever.

American King James Version
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which lives and stays for ever.

American Standard Version
having been begotten again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, through the word of God, which liveth and abideth.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Being born again not of corruptible seed, but incorruptible, by the word of God who liveth and remaineth for ever.

Darby Bible Translation
being born again , not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by [the] living and abiding word of God.

Originally posted by sonship
Past tense, past tense, past tense (or continuing in the present still) on THIS side of the millennial restoration.

[b] NET Bible
You have been born anew, not from perishable but from imperishable seed, through the living and enduring word of God.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
As persons who have been born aga ...[text shortened]... ot of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by [the] living and abiding word of God.

Born again and regeneration are two separate and distinct events.

Originally posted by Rajk999

Regeneration is not in the book of Peter.

First Peter 1:23

Most English version say born again or born anew.
The Recovery Version says "regenerated".
But even if it did join the majority of English translations, you STILL would not be able to erase the fact that Peter is speaking of something that is not GOING to happen in the future (in this case). But it HAS happened to them already in the church age.

"Having BEEN born again ... " as I showed multiple times.

Now for John 3:

When Nicodemus asked Jesus -

"How can a man be born when he is old? "

If the ONLY POSSIBLE thing Jesus meant was the coming millennial age then all He had to do was say WHEN and old man enters into the millennial age.

He had something ELSE in mind - a birth from above rather than a birth in the future. He had in mind a birth from the Spirit rather than just a birth with a new restored earth.

Of course there will be a restoration [regeneration] of the earth at the millennial time. But in John 3 Jesus was not speaking of that time but of some event before that time.

Unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God. And I think that is in ANY sense. He cannot perceive that kingdom or understand that kingdom and cannot SEE that kingdom unless he undergoes the new birth from above.

Whatever was meant by -

"The wind blows where it wills, and ou hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

There is nothing about that sentence that proves Jesus could only be talking about the next age.

The New Testament genuine Christians have BEEN regenerated - born again. And that is why Paul says that in THIS age, PRESENTLY (not after the 2nd coming) the Holy Spirit bears witness within them that they ARE children of God.

" The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God." (Rom. 8:16)

No, Rajk999, not "WILL bear witness in the next age when the millennial kingdom arrives." NOW in the church age the genuine Christians have this co-witnessing within - our spirit WITH the indwelling Holy Spirit. Today - we are children of God.

Let's see how Rajk999 will twist this passage to argue that Christians (not nominal ones) are born again to be God's children in THIS age.

Originally posted by sonship

Regeneration is not in the book of Peter.

[b] First Peter 1:23

Most English version say born again or born anew.
The Recovery Version says "regenerated".
But even if it did join the majority of English translations, you STILL would not be able to erase the fact that Peter is speaking of something that is not GOING to h ...[text shortened]... There is nothing about that sentence that proves Jesus could only be talking about the next age.[/b]

Whatever was meant by that:

"The wind blows where it wills, and ou hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

is that nobody is regenerated. All of mankind wait for the return of Christ. Tough .. get used to it and stop deluding yourself.

Originally posted by Rajk999

"The wind blows where it wills, and ou hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

is that nobody is regenerated. All of mankind wait for the return of Christ. Tough .. get used to it and stop deluding yourself.

You are teaching that no one on this side of the second coming of Christ is "born of the Spirit." However, the New Testament does not agree with you.

The Spirit is one spirit with the believers in Corinth and all believers.

"He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit" (1 Cor. 6:17)

Are you saying that for men to be "one spirit" with the Holy Spirit is NOT to be born of the Spirit ?

To be "one spirit" with the Spirit of Christ certainly is to be born of the Spirit because Romans says the Spirit bears witness with the Christian's spirit that he is one of the "children of God."

" The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God." (Rom. 8:16)

I know that I am born of God and am one of the children of God in the church age because the Holy Spirit is one spirit with my spirit and bears witness with my spirit that God is my Father and that I am born as one of His children.

He didn't say that the Spirit WILL ... IN THE FUTURE .... during the millennial kingdom bear witness that I am one of the children of God. Surely wonderful things happen at that time of which I hope to partake. But the experience of being born of the Spirit is for the time between the resurrection of Christ up TO the second coming of Christ.

Originally posted by sonship

[b] "The wind blows where it wills, and ou hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

is that nobody is regenerated. All of mankind wait for the return of Christ. Tough .. get used to it and stop deluding yourself.

You are teaching tha ...[text shortened]... the Spirit is for the time between the resurrection of Christ up TO the second coming of Christ.[/b]

Its simple. Get a sharp kitchen knife, cut yourself. If you see blood then you are not regenerated and you are still a physical, mortal, corruptible frail human.

If you are regenerated you are a spirit being, incorruptible and immortal, that can move like the wind, and not a flesh and blood human.

Originally posted by Rajk999

Its simple. Get a sharp kitchen knife, cut yourself. If you see blood then you are not regenerated and you are still a physical, mortal, corruptible frail human.

This does not do anything to refute the clear explanation I just gave from 1 Cor. 6:17; Rom. 8:16. All you do is shrug and IGNORE.

Shrug and ignore does not make a good case for what you want to teach here.

Again, you simply DO NOT DEAL with - "joined to the Lord is one spirit" . You shrug and ignore. You DO NOT DEAL with - "the Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit." about the Christians being the children of God.

You just wave us over to another argument. Which is -

If you are regenerated you are a spirit being, incorruptible and immortal, that can move like the wind, and not a flesh and blood human.

It may be tempting to think that Jesus is describing the one born of the Spirit when saying -

" ... so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

I.E. You cannot see him. You cannot detect when he comes or when he goes. I don't think Jesus is describing every person who is born of the Spirit with these words. I think He was speaking of the mysterious effect of the Spirit on man. The result we can see. But the Spirit's coming and going is hard to see.

It is not as easy to see as baptism. The man goes down into the water. The man comes up out of the water. The people witnessing baptism at the hands of John the Baptist and even the disciples of Jesus. But the new birth from the Holy Spirit is not as obvious to witness physically.

I think that is what Jesus meant by -

"The wind blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is goin; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

I don't think He meant (in John 3) that during the millennial kingdom all the saints will be invisible vapors or breezes invisible to everyone, yet heard.

To say that this being born of the Spirit cannot take place in the church age is wrong.
John tells the Christians that everyone who believes in Christ has been BEGOTTEN of God. And that is REGENERATED and BORN OF THE SPIRIT.

" Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been begotten of God, and everyone who loves Him who begets, loves him who has been begotten of Him." ( 1 John 5:1)

1.) If what you teach is true then no one has been begotten of God until the millennial kingdom.

2.) If what you teach is true then no one believes that Jesus is the Christ until the millennial kingdom.

3.) If what you teach is true then no one loves others having also been begotten of God until the millennial kingdom.

4.) If what you teach is true then John means - "Everyone who enters the millennial kingdom after the second coming of Christ is begotten of God. . And that would mean that no one in the church age is begotten of God.

Your wrong teaching postpones all new birth from the Holy Spirit until after the start of the millennium. But John says there the believers can know TODAY that God has given to us of His Spirit - ie. "born of the Spirit" :

" In this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, that He has given us of His Spirit." ( 4:13)

Paul also tells the Galatians the God, in that present church age then, before the millennium was supplying to them the Holy Spirit -

" He therefore WHO IS supplying to you the Spirit, DOING works of power among you, is it by the works of law or by the hearing of faith?" (Gal. 3:5)

In the church age God is SUPPLYING [present tense] "the Spirit" to those born of the Spirit before the millennium.

And Paul says that they ARE on this side of the millennial kingdom - "sons of God" crying Abba Father by the indwelling Holy Spirit.

"And because you are sons, [not WILL BE sons if you WAIT until the millennial kingdom] God sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, Abba Father !" (Gal. 4:6)

ABBA! - PAPA - DADDY to God - because they are born of God - regenerated to be His children and even His sons.

Originally posted by sonship
I don't think He meant (in John 3) that during the millennial kingdom all the saints will be invisible vapors or breezes invisible to everyone, yet heard.

To say that this being born of the Spirit cannot take place in the church age is wrong.
John tells the Christians that everyone who believes in Christ has been [b] BEGOTTEN of God. And ...[text shortened]... o God - because they are born of God - regenerated to be His children and even His sons.[/b]

Jesus said : Joh_3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Sonship Says: Blah blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.

Jesus said : The regeneration takes place when he returns

Sonship Says: Blah blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.

Case closed. 😀

Sonship Says: Blah blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.

Regeneration is being born again. The human is born with the natural life. The second birth which comes with receiving Jesus Christ is a receiving of God's life.

Regeneration in the New Testament is not turning over a new leaf or self reforming. It has nothing to do with self improvement. It is to be born once again, not with the natural life, but with the Holy Spirit bringing God's life into us.

Regeneration is not giving us God's life only because we are sinful. No doubt fallen man is sinful. But if we were not sinful we would still need to receive the divine seed of God's life within us in order to fulfill God's eternal purpose to live in man.

God did not create man with God's life.
God did not create man sinful either.

Though God did not create man sinful He still wanted man to partake of "the tree of life" signifying that God wanted man to receive God's life.

Adam was created good and neutral. In his good and neutral state God still wanted this natural man to partake of the divine life of God. That is why God placed Adam before "the tree of life" representing the divine life of God. God wanted to dispense His life into man even when man was good, innocent and neutral.

Now that man has become sinful and fallen God's original intention has not change. To participate in the kingdom of God God wants man to have the divine life of that kingdom. So Jesus told the rather good man (by human standards) Nicodemus, that he MUST be born again.That means he MUST be regenerated.

Originally posted by Rajk999

Jesus said : The regeneration takes place when he returns

Sonship Says: Blah blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.

Case closed.

Before the physical return of the Lord Jesus the Apostle John said the believers in Christ were begotten of God:

" Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been begotten of God." (1 John 5:1a)

And for the last 20 centuries and until the time of the second coming of Christ -

" Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been begotten of God." (1 John 5:1a)

Originally posted by sonship

Jesus said : The regeneration takes place when he returns

Sonship Says: Blah blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah blah.Blah blah blah ...[text shortened]... one who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been begotten of God." (1 John 5:1a)

[/b]

Begotten of God

IS NOT THE SAME

IS NOT THE SAME

IS NOT THE SAME

IS NOT THE SAME

As Regeneration.

Get that in your thick skull