1. Joined
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    09 Feb '08 16:02
    I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
    C. S. Lewis

    I also believe in Christianity, when people say "Prove" God is real. You cant actually prove God "exists", you can only believe he "exists". However when people say God doesnt "exist", there is no proof that he does exist, but also there is no proof that he "doesnt exist."
  2. Donationrwingett
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    09 Feb '08 17:37
    Originally posted by TheSilentHunter
    I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
    C. S. Lewis

    I also believe in Christianity, when people say "Prove" God is real. You cant actually prove God "exists", you can only believe he "exists". However when people say God doesnt "exist", there is no proof that he does exist, but also there is no proof that he "doesnt exist."
    The burden of proof is on you.
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    09 Feb '08 17:42
    The only other things I can think of that cannot be proven or disproven are other, non-christian Gods. You cannot prove or disprove Thor, but I would hope nobody believes in him any more.
  4. Subscriberjosephw
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    09 Feb '08 18:02
    Originally posted by rwingett
    The burden of proof is on you.
    The proof is in creation.
  5. Donationrwingett
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    09 Feb '08 18:21
    Originally posted by josephw
    The proof is in creation.
    Obviously you are wrong. I do not agree that nature has been "created." You cannot "prove" anything in that regard, nor even demonstrate it convincingly.
  6. Subscriberjosephw
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    09 Feb '08 18:34
    Originally posted by rwingett
    Obviously you are wrong. I do not agree that nature has been "created." You cannot "prove" anything in that regard, nor even demonstrate it convincingly.
    I'm not trying to prove anything. All I said was that creation proves God exists. To me that means that what has been made is the evidence for a creator.

    Since you don't believe that what exists was created, then please tell me how everything came into existence. I would really like to hear your explanation. And I don't mean that sarcastically either.
  7. Donationrwingett
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    09 Feb '08 18:46
    Originally posted by josephw
    I'm not trying to prove anything. All I said was that creation proves God exists. To me that means that what has been made is the evidence for a creator.

    Since you don't believe that what exists was created, then please tell me how everything came into existence. I would really like to hear your explanation. And I don't mean that sarcastically either.
    ???

    You're not trying to prove anything, but then claim that creation "proves" god exists? If that's not trying to prove something, then what is?

    If you want to get a better idea on how things came into existence then go read some books on cosmology, astronomy and biology. I'm not going to spell it all out for you.
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    09 Feb '08 18:53

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  9. Subscriberjosephw
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    09 Feb '08 18:531 edit
    Originally posted by rwingett
    ???

    You're not trying to prove anything, but then claim that creation "proves" god exists? If that's not trying to prove something, then what is?

    If you want to get a better idea on how things came into existence then go read some books on cosmology, astronomy and biology. I'm not going to spell it all out for you.
    And no doubt those books, (written by man), will tell me that God didn't create the universe.

    What I'm saying is that it is an observable and objective fact that creation itself proves the existence of God.

    [b]..."I'm not going to spell it all out for you."

    Try!
  10. Standard memberKellyJay
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    09 Feb '08 19:05
    Originally posted by rwingett
    The burden of proof is on you.
    I don't believe so, the real burden will be denying Him when you come
    face to face with Him and you have your whole life in front of you.
    Kelly
  11. Gangster Land
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    09 Feb '08 19:17
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I don't believe so, the real burden will be denying Him when you come
    face to face with Him and you have your whole life in front of you.
    Kelly
    Look, if I have to face God at the end of this dog and pony show, and he wants to know why I stopped believing in him...I can say with a completely clear heart that the evidence for his existence did not pass muster, and if he is upset by that I will tell him to blame the critical thinking skills he created me with.
  12. Donationrwingett
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    09 Feb '08 19:29
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I don't believe so, the real burden will be denying Him when you come
    face to face with Him and you have your whole life in front of you.
    Kelly
    Perhaps you're right. But I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
  13. Standard memberKellyJay
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    09 Feb '08 19:37
    Originally posted by rwingett
    Perhaps you're right. But I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
    No you are risking a lot more than that.
    Kelly
  14. Standard memberKellyJay
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    09 Feb '08 19:39
    Originally posted by TheSkipper
    Look, if I have to face God at the end of this dog and pony show, and he wants to know why I stopped believing in him...I can say with a completely clear heart that the evidence for his existence did not pass muster, and if he is upset by that I will tell him to blame the critical thinking skills he created me with.
    So your defence is going to be, God it is your fault. I think Adam did
    that one too, didn't get him far. Did you ever have a relationship with
    God to walk away from, or did you just think He was there and stopped
    thinking that way?
    Kelly
  15. Donationrwingett
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    09 Feb '08 19:44
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    No you are risking a lot more than that.
    Kelly
    And you could be wasting your time believing in a non-existent god. Or you could be worshiping the wrong god. If you're trying to employ Pascal's wager, the argument does not impress me. I'll take my chances.
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