Originally posted by KellyJayRomans 2:14-16
Cleared up? Tell me how do you know without Jesus Christ someone can live righteously?
When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law unto themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the day when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all.
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Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeA passage many Christians wish were not in the Bible. Here is another one:
Romans 2:14-16
When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law unto themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the da ...[text shortened]... when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all.
.. If we love one another,, God dwelleth in us, .. (1 John 4:12 KJV)
.. every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. (1 John 4:7 KJV)
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeThis shows that they know to do good, but none of us always do good. We sin, even the
Romans 2:14-16
When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law unto themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the da ...[text shortened]... when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all.
very best among us falter and do things they regret, things that harms others, choose to
do and say things that are harmful. The measure of good isn't us, it is God, God is the
standard and when Jesus walked among us as a man He did it sinless. So when we are
compared to that standard we have all fallen short. When everyone looks at another and
says this one is better than that one, the only thing we are doing is comparing one sinner
against another, one flawed person against another. There will always be some better
than others, that doesn't make them good.
Worldly example: I and friends of mine got together at lunch to taste test hot sauces. We
each brought some and we were dipping our food chicken wings into them. Another friend
shows up and asks to join us, we told her these were hot sauces, and not the mild kind
she was use to but HOT sauces.
"Which one is the mildest?" she asked and we tell her. "Spontaneous combustion" which
has a great flavor. She took that this is the mildest to mean it was mild, it is not. She soon
found out as we were feeding her bread and drinks hot means hot. With us it is sinner
means sinner, even the best of us are sinners.
If you look at the verse you quoted you'll see we do know what to do and not do and that
is something we know instinctively, it also says that we become a law unto ourselves, so
if I condemn anyone for something I later allow myself to do than I've broken my own law.
Our consciences will bear witness and when Jesus judges us nothing is going to be done
or said in secret it will all be on full display. When that time occurs you think anyone is
going to be perfectly righteous before God without God's grace and mercy on us so we
can be forgiven?
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkOk .. read it and it makes no sense. John is speaking of brotherly or charitable love. Basically the point is that people who are compassionate to those in need and who show charity to others are demonstrating the love of God. This is what Jesus said a zillion times, and it is this quality that determines who gets into the Kingdom of God and who gets cast out ... again as Jesus said.
Read this http://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionary/love/
and let me know what you think.
That is all. Its not a complicated matter as your website tries to make it.
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Originally posted by Rajk999So if an adulterer is compassionate to those in need then their compassion determines that they get into the Kingdom of God even if they continue in their adultery?
Ok .. read it and it makes no sense. John is speaking of brotherly or charitable love. Basically the point is that people who are compassionate to those in need and who show charity to others are demonstrating the love of God. This is what Jesus said a zillion times, and it is this quality that determines who gets into the Kingdom of God and who gets cast o ...[text shortened]... in as Jesus said.
That is all. Its not a complicated matter as your website tries to make it.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkJesus is the righteous judge that knows how to judge. It is Christians that try to eliminate nonChristians from judgement and from Gods Kingdom.
So if an adulterer is compassionate to those in need then their compassion determines that they get into the Kingdom of God?
Heb_4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
.. by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. (James 2:24-26 KJV)
Let Jesus Christ do His job.
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Originally posted by Rajk999
.. by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. (James 2:24-26 KJV)
Let Jesus Christ do His job.
The example of Rehab is an excellent illustration of how Jesus does his job.
When Rehab put out the scarlet thread the judgment completely passed over her house. Everyone in the house was saved.
The armies did not look inside to see if there were good people or bad people in that house. They just spared the house and all that were in the house. Read the story again.
So God did the job of saving the whole house (which may have been a house of prostitution) based on their believing that they should remain inside with the seal of the red thread on the outside.
God did His job and Rehab and her household were saved.
Originally posted by KellyJayThis shows that they know to do good, but none of us always do good. We sin, even the very best among us falter and do things they regret, things that harms others, choose to do and say things that are harmful. The measure of good isn't us, it is God, God is the standard and when Jesus walked among us as a man He did it sinless. So when we are compared to that standard we have all fallen short. When everyone looks at another and says this one is better than that one, the only thing we are doing is comparing one sinner against another, one flawed person against another. There will always be some better than others, that doesn't make them good.
Worldly example: I and friends of mine got together at lunch to taste test hot sauces. We each brought some and we were dipping our food chicken wings into them. Another friend shows up and asks to join us, we told her these were hot sauces, and not the mild kind she was use to but HOT sauces.
"Which one is the mildest?" she asked and we tell her. "Spontaneous combustion" which has a great flavor. She took that this is the mildest to mean it was mild, it is not. She soon found out as we were feeding her bread and drinks hot means hot. With us it is sinner means sinner, even the best of us are sinners.
If you look at the verse you quoted you'll see we do know what to do and not do and that is something we know instinctively, it also says that we become a law unto ourselves, so if I condemn anyone for something I later allow myself to do than I've broken my own law. Our consciences will bear witness and when Jesus judges us nothing is going to be done or said in secret it will all be on full display. When that time occurs you think anyone is going to be perfectly righteous before God without God's grace and mercy on us so we can be forgiven?
Do you wish Romans 2:14-16 wasn't in the Bible?