Hitler

Originally posted by josephw
So, you're not a pacifist. Have you ever killed in self defense? Know anyone who has?.

No. I am not a pacifist. I'm not sure what you're on about. Have you read the preceding conversation?

Originally posted by josephw
That's girly talk.

Huh?

Originally posted by FMF
I'm not sure what you're on about.

You say that a lot. Of course you're unsure.

Originally posted by josephw
[b]".., the only scenario I can think of where I would kill your kids to save my own kids..."

That's girly talk.[/b]

I'd kill your kids just for insulting mine. That's how manly I am. 🙄

Originally posted by FMF
Apologies to everyone else, ...

Oh no. It's far too late for this pretense to be believable. How many threads filled with hundreds of posts per day to the exclusion of all other conversation has it been now?

Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
Oh no. It's far too late for this pretense to be believable. How many threads filled with hundreds of posts per day to the exclusion of all other conversation has it been now?

Well there are dozens of other threads where Fetchmyjunk and I are not active that you could contribute to. Or you could have contributed more to this conversation if you'd wanted to push it in a direction that was more interesting to you. Or you could start a new conversation that you'd be more interested in or that you think would be more interesting for others than this one. But for you to interrupt this one to tell everyone that you are not interested in the conversation that's been going on or that other people have been posting too much seems like the least interesting contributions that you could have possibly come up with. And yet this is what you've done. 😉

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Would the act of rape also be morally justifiable if it is done to protect your family from harm?

Well of course I don't know for sure exactly how I would react in a grotesquely traumatic situation, none of us could know for sure. Have you read any of the work of Elie Weisel? Sobering stuff. Not a lot left to the imagination.

So, your vague scenario? I can simply tell you what I imagine my reaction would be, what I think would occur, and what I believe would be the probable outcome.

First of all, I cannot actually imagine how the 'offer' to spare my family in exchange for committing rape could be made to me in a way that that was genuine or believable. You declined to do this. It makes your scenario seem smarmy, petri dish-esque, and stripped of any genuine humanity, unlike my scenario about lying to protect one's loved ones, which was based on actual events.

You seem to want to equate ~ morally ~ lying to someone with raping someone, which strikes me as so morally tone deaf, that you are either a truly boggle eyed ideologue, or you're just trolling me.

But, anyway, if it somehow were to be "genuine", I would immediately consider myself to be as good as dead.

Genuine or not, I wouldn't be able to rape anyone and would not be able to agree to do it, unless prtending to agree to it was a mere stalling tactic. I would probably try to incapacitate, or, if necessary, kill the person trying to coerce me and threaten my family in this way, and would probably die doing so.

If I killed him in that situation, I would not consider it to be morally unsound.

So, I imagine that I - and perhaps my family too - would end up dead in such a scenario ~ that is, in a scenario in which we were assaulted by the kind of psychopathic, murderous men that would offer such a depraved bargain.

Do you know exactly how you would react in such a traumatic situation?

Originally posted by FMF
Well there are dozens of other threads where Fetchmyjunk and I are not active that you could contribute to. Or you could have contributed more to this conversation if you'd wanted to push it in a direction that was more interesting to you. Or you could start a new conversation that you'd be more interested in or that you think would be more interesting for othe ...[text shortened]... contributions that you could have possibly come up with. And yet this is what you've done. 😉

Or maybe I actually did all those things and you were too busy re-pasting the same tired, windy paragraphs over and over again to notice. 😉

(and this to someone you know to be a troll and wouldn't take any of it seriously.)

Originally posted by FMF
If the scenario you're talking about is something along the lines of the trolley problem then yes, I would imagine I would instinctively choose my children over yours.

That's not a problem.

Otherwise, the only scenario I can think of where I would kill your kids to save my own kids would be if your kids were about to murder mine, and the if only way to stop them was to use physical force (that might in fact end up being lethal force) against yours to prevent it from happening. That's off the top of my head.

That's not a problem, either.

What about you in these two scenarios?
A madman holds your kids hostage and will kill them unless you kill my children. You believe him. You have access to my children, plus you know, access to guns and knives and firebombs and poison and anything you might want here. So what's your move now?

Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
Or maybe I actually did all those things and you were too busy re-pasting the same tired, windy paragraphs over and over again to notice.

I didn't find anything you said interesting so I said nothing. You seem to want to say things about stuff you don't find interesting, even when there are dozens and dozens of other threads you can post on.

Originally posted by apathist
A madman holds your kids hostage and will kill them unless you kill my children. You believe him. You have access to my children, plus you know, access to guns and knives and firebombs and poison and anything you might want here. So what's your move now?

With the proviso that none of us know for sure exactly how we would react in such extreme situations ~ so it's a talk the talk thing, rather than walk the walk ~ I'd say I couldn't kill your children in that situation. I think I could kill him (the madman) if I had the ability and the opportunity, but I can't imagine being able to bring myself to kill your children.

Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
I'd kill your kids just for insulting mine. That's how manly I am. 🙄

You'd be dead before you could think of it. That's how manly I am. 🙄

Originally posted by FMF
With the proviso that none of us know for sure exactly how we would react in such extreme situations ~ so it's a talk the talk thing, rather than walk the walk ~ I'd say I couldn't kill your children in that situation. I think I could kill him (the madman) if I had the ability and the opportunity, but I can't imagine being able to bring myself to kill your children.

I think for once I have to agree with you, but don't "think", just kill the madman. It's your right and responsibility. In my opinion.

Originally posted by josephw
I think for once I have to agree with you, but don't "think", just kill the madman. It's your right and responsibility. In my opinion.

You think you have a right to kill mad people?!

What about people with just mild depression or a dodgy hip?

Originally posted by FMF
Well of course I don't know for sure exactly how I would react in a grotesquely traumatic situation, none of us could know for sure. Have you read any of the work of Elie Weisel? Sobering stuff. Not a lot left to the imagination.

So, your vague scenario? I can simply tell you what I imagine my reaction would be, what I think would occur, and what I believe w ...[text shortened]... h a depraved bargain.

Do you know exactly how you would react in such a traumatic situation?

If someone else were in your shoes and the carried out the act, and by carrying out the act were able to save their family, would you consider their act to be immoral? Also why do you think committing the act of murder would be justifiable and not the act of rape? Do you believe the act of rape is more morally repulsive that the act of murder?