1. Subscriberduecer
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    02 Aug '09 11:00
    I was doing a bit of reading this weekend, and came across this gem that was sleeping dormant in my subconcious. Its a great caution for those who like to sit in judgment of others, and who think only their way is the right way. plz read and post your commentary here.

    1My brothers, as believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ, don't show favoritism. 2Suppose a man comes into your meeting wearing a gold ring and fine clothes, and a poor man in shabby clothes also comes in. 3If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, "Here's a good seat for you," but say to the poor man, "You stand there" or "Sit on the floor by my feet," 4have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts?
    5Listen, my dear brothers: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him? 6But you have insulted the poor. Is it not the rich who are exploiting you? Are they not the ones who are dragging you into court? 7Are they not the ones who are slandering the noble name of him to whom you belong?

    8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself,"[a] you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. 10For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11For he who said, "Do not commit adultery,"[b] also said, "Do not murder."[c] If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.

    12Speak and act as those who are going to be judged by the law that gives freedom, 13because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment!

    Faith and Deeds
    14What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? 15Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
    18But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds."
    Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do.

    19You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.

    20You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[d]? 21Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23And the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,"[e] and he was called God's friend. 24You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.

    25In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.
  2. Joined
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    02 Aug '09 11:21
    Originally posted by duecer
    I was doing a bit of reading this weekend, and came across this gem that was sleeping dormant in my subconcious. Its a great caution for those who like to sit in judgment of others, and who think only their way is the right way. plz read and post your commentary here.

    1My brothers, as believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ, don't show favoritism. 2Su ...[text shortened]... ? 26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.
    1 Corinthians 2:15
    But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

    What do you mean by judging? Judgement has, to the best of my knowledge, two expressions.

    1. To condemn.

    2. To name it like it is.

    Which one are you referring to?
  3. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
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    02 Aug '09 11:37
    Originally posted by duecer
    I was doing a bit of reading this weekend, and came across this gem that was sleeping dormant in my subconcious. Its a great caution for those who like to sit in judgment of others, and who think only their way is the right way. plz read and post your commentary here.

    1My brothers, as believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ, don't show favoritism. 2Su ...[text shortened]... ? 26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.
    What I think is significant is that Jesus thinks the rich exploit and oppress the poor and that it is the poor who shall inherit the kingdom. If this doesn't make Jesus a socialist, I don't know what does.
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    02 Aug '09 15:15
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What I think is significant is that Jesus thinks the rich exploit and oppress the poor and that it is the poor who shall inherit the kingdom. If this doesn't make Jesus a socialist, I don't know what does.
    Rich and poor can also mean in spirit.
  5. Donationrwingett
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    02 Aug '09 16:28
    Originally posted by daniel58
    Rich and poor can also mean in spirit.
    The rich in spirit exploit the poor in spirit? I'm afraid that doesn't make much sense. It seems clear that Jesus is talking about rich and poor in the monetary sense. And time and time again, throughout the bible, Jesus comes down on the side of the poor against the rich.
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    02 Aug '09 16:44
    Originally posted by rwingett
    The rich in spirit exploit the poor in spirit? I'm afraid that doesn't make much sense. It seems clear that Jesus is talking about rich and poor in the monetary sense. And time and time again, throughout the bible, Jesus comes down on the side of the poor against the rich.
    They probably did a lot in those days, probably.
  7. Standard memberKellyJay
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    02 Aug '09 17:001 edit
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What I think is significant is that Jesus thinks the rich exploit and oppress the poor and that it is the poor who shall inherit the kingdom. If this doesn't make Jesus a socialist, I don't know what does.
    I think you are in error, Jesus is pointing out two things, one as you
    correctly point out class among us is not important, but you should
    also glean from this that exploiting is wrong, there are those that
    think if it done to the rich it is okay. It is still exploiting and it is still
    wrong and it is still looking at people in terms of class and not just
    looking at them in terms of being people, and only people.
    Kelly
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    02 Aug '09 19:183 edits
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What I think is significant is that Jesus thinks the rich exploit and oppress the poor and that it is the poor who shall inherit the kingdom. If this doesn't make Jesus a socialist, I don't know what does.
    Do you think that Christ would agree with mandating people give their money to the poor verses voluntarily giving it? Personally, I think he would be appalled at the government forceably taking it from you and then skimming some off the top to then redistribute, not on the basis of need, but on the basis of entitlement. Entitlements rob the giver of the blessings of giving and it robs the reciever of the gift of gratitude for obtaining it. It not only creates an attitude of "You owe me" it also fosters an attitude that it is never enough. Can you just picture people coming up to Jesus and demand he turn water into wine for them or turn bread and fish into enough to feed a multitude? LOL. In fact, the Israelite nation that God set up had no such entitlements in it, rather, they simply made available charitable means for the poor to exist.
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    02 Aug '09 19:224 edits
    Originally posted by josephw
    1 Corinthians 2:15
    But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

    What do you mean by judging? Judgement has, to the best of my knowledge, two expressions.

    1. To condemn.

    2. To name it like it is.

    Which one are you referring to?
    You got that right!! 😉 There is a big difference between calling certain acts sinful verses judging those who commit such acts.
  10. Donationrwingett
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    02 Aug '09 20:32
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I think you are in error, Jesus is pointing out two things, one as you
    correctly point out class among us is not important, but you should
    also glean from this that exploiting is wrong, there are those that
    think if it done to the rich it is okay. It is still exploiting and it is still
    wrong and it is still looking at people in terms of class and not just
    looking at them in terms of being people, and only people.
    Kelly
    The poor exploiting the rich? Are you daft?
  11. Subscriberduecer
    anybody seen my
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    02 Aug '09 20:382 edits
    Originally posted by whodey
    Can you just picture people coming up to Jesus and demand he turn water into wine for them or turn bread and fish into enough to feed a multitude
    Read John chapter 6, people essentially do just that, his response is not only terse but answers that point
  12. Donationrwingett
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    02 Aug '09 20:39
    Originally posted by whodey
    Do you think that Christ would agree with mandating people give their money to the poor verses voluntarily giving it? Personally, I think he would be appalled at the government forceably taking it from you and then skimming some off the top to then redistribute, not on the basis of need, but on the basis of entitlement. Entitlements rob the giver of the ble ...[text shortened]... entitlements in it, rather, they simply made available charitable means for the poor to exist.
    If people voluntarily gave, they would inherit the kingdom. It is the only way they will inherit the kingdom. In the meantime we establish governments amongst ourselves to mitigate the effects of man's greed.
  13. Standard memberKellyJay
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    02 Aug '09 21:01
    Originally posted by rwingett
    The poor exploiting the rich? Are you daft?
    The poor not so much as having it done in the name of the poor is!
    Kelly
  14. Standard memberKellyJay
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    02 Aug '09 21:02
    Originally posted by rwingett
    If people voluntarily gave, they would inherit the kingdom. It is the only way they will inherit the kingdom. In the meantime we establish governments amongst ourselves to mitigate the effects of man's greed.
    Not true, you cannot buy your way into the Kingdom of God.
    Kelly
  15. Subscriberduecer
    anybody seen my
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    02 Aug '09 21:14
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    Not true, you cannot buy your way into the Kingdom of God.
    Kelly
    Jesus told the rich man to sell all his possesions and give them to the poor. It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God
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