1. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
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    01 Nov '11 12:25
    Originally posted by Doward
    A Christian's loyalty and committment belongs to the kingdom of God first, last and always. I see no scriptural justification for condemning them because they refuse to be a part of the military or government. It is a matter of conscience, and that is after all the whole point of the new covenant. (Hebrews 10).
    There is no scriptual bases for them to condemn me for being part of the
    military and the government; yet they have tried to add to and twist scripture
    to do just that. I have pointed this out on another thread. I have been trying
    to defend my faith and belief that it is not a sin to serve in the Military or the
    government and that scripture does not say we should be NO PART of this
    world, meaning to serve in the goverments. It is a good thing that not all
    people believe as they do for we would have no governments because no
    person would be willing to serve. This is Satanic and antichrist propaganda
    for Christ meant no such thing.
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    01 Nov '11 12:29
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    This is Satanic and antichrist propaganda
    for Christ meant no such thing.
    Satanic?
  3. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
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    01 Nov '11 12:37
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    Unlike the Jehovah's Witnesses who refuse to serve in the military Desmond
    Doss, a seventh Day Adventist, served as a conscientious objecter in the U.S.
    Army assigned to the Medical Detachment, 307th Infantry, 77th Infantry Division.

    He was the first conscientious objector to receive the Medal of Honor.

    After a heavy concentration of artillery, morta ...[text shortened]... allantry far above and beyond the call of duty.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desmond_Doss
    During WWI two Hutterite brothers (Michael and Joseph Hofer), who refused to comply with the draft, were tortured and died from mistreatment in Fort Leavenworth Military Prison. Their absolute pacifism and refusal to wear the uniform of the US military made them martyrs for their faith.

    Would you consider them more or less worthy of praise than Desmond Doss?
  4. Standard memberRJHinds
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    01 Nov '11 12:39
    Originally posted by FMF
    Satanic?
    Well, the Holy Bible says the purpose of governments if to provide for
    the welfare of the people and the idea to refuse to serve is a Satanic
    idea to destroy the governments that God establishes.
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    01 Nov '11 12:44
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    Well, the Holy Bible says the purpose of governments if to provide for
    the welfare of the people and the idea to refuse to serve is a Satanic
    idea to destroy the governments that God establishes.
    Conscientious objection is a Satanic idea?
  6. Standard memberRJHinds
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    01 Nov '11 12:48
    Originally posted by rwingett
    During WWI two Hutterite brothers (Michael and Joseph Hofer), who refused to comply with the draft, were tortured and died from mistreatment in Fort Leavenworth Military Prison. Their absolute pacifism and refusal to wear the uniform of the US military made them martyrs for their faith.

    Would you consider them more or less worthy of praise than Desmond Doss?
    They should not have been tortured if what you say is true.
    But I don't see that they did anything worthy of praise. In
    fact it seems they refused to do anything. To follow a false
    teaching should never gain anyone praise. We must follow
    the truth. I think Desmond Doss followed the true spirit of
    the teaching of Christ.
  7. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
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    01 Nov '11 12:50
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    They should not have been tortured if what you say is true.
    But I don't see that they did anything worthy of praise. In
    fact it seems they refused to do anything. To follow a false
    teaching should never gain anyone praise. We must follow
    the truth. I think Desmond Doss followed the true spirit of
    the teaching of Christ.
    What false teaching did they follow?
  8. Standard memberRJHinds
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    01 Nov '11 12:54
    Originally posted by FMF
    Conscientious objection is a Satanic idea?
    No, Desmond Doss was a conscientious objector and he still served in
    another way and I believe he was blessed by God for it. It is doing
    nothing that is Satanic. It is like the parable of the talents in which
    the evil servant hid the talent and did nothing with it.
  9. Standard memberRJHinds
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    01 Nov '11 12:58
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What false teaching did they follow?
    I do not know these men. I was only going by what you told me.
    So if they were taught by a religious teacher that they should not serve
    in the military or the government in any capacity then they were
    following a false teaching.
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    01 Nov '11 13:00
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    No, Desmond Doss was a conscientious objector and he still served in
    another way and I believe he was blessed by God for it. It is doing
    nothing that is Satanic. It is like the parable of the talents in which
    the evil servant hid the talent and did nothing with it.
    You suggested that the bible states that conscientious objection on the part of Christians you disagree with is a Satanic idea. That's what I am referring to. Pretending I am referring to Desmond Doss is just a waste of a post.
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    01 Nov '11 13:08
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What false teaching did they follow?
    it as yet remains unanswered.
  12. Cape Town
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    01 Nov '11 13:48
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    I think Desmond Doss followed the true spirit of the teaching of Christ.
    So I presume that you too refuse to kill while in the military?
  13. Standard memberkaroly aczel
    The Axe man
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    01 Nov '11 13:58
    Originally posted by FMF
    Your OP and follow up posts strike me as a bit gratuitous and not especially 'spiritual' in nature. I think an attack like this probably belongs on the Debates Forum, as you seem intent - in your bitter spirit of Christian infighting - on being pointed and personal rather than seeking any spiritual insight or consensus.
    Like anyone's trying to reach a consensus on this forum. How boring that would be ..
  14. Donationbbarr
    Chief Justice
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    01 Nov '11 14:09
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    I do not know these men. I was only going by what you told me.
    So if they were taught by a religious teacher that they should not serve
    in the military or the government in any capacity then they were
    following a false teaching.
    Roughly 5,000 JW's died in concentration camps in WW2. They refused any manner of military service, and it was their pacifism that got them interned. They were given the option of release if they disavowed their faith and swore to take up weapons and protect the fatherland, but few if any did. Should they have simply served in the German army? Was this pacifism Satanic?
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    01 Nov '11 14:29
    Originally posted by karoly aczel
    Like anyone's trying to reach a consensus on this forum. How boring that would be ..
    I think a consensus that Christians simply don't need to accuse each other of being Satanic, in some kind of twisted display of theolomachismo, would not be boring in the slightest.
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