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Originally posted by @divegeesterHow many times in the past have you seen me refer to as many as 12 to 15 OTHER English translations of the Bible?
Try using a different translation of the bible, other than the one that is biased towards your own beliefs, and many of the doctrinal knots will naturally drop out of your strange rope.
Edit: and if you insist on using this one it would be good form for you to cite the version as you have been requested to do many times before.
#onlinerecoveryversion
I have often used BibleHub to show alternative renderings of passages. If I was stuck on the Recovery Version I would have never volunteered so often to allow people to compare.
I think you're ringing a false alarm.
John 14:1
English Standard Version
“Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me.
Berean Study Bible
Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; believe in Me as well.
Berean Literal Bible
Let not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in Me.
New American Standard Bible
"Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me.
King James Bible
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
"Your heart must not be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in Me.
International Standard Version
"Don't let your hearts be troubled. Believe in God, believe also in me.
NET Bible
"Do not let your hearts be distressed. You believe in God; believe also in me.
New Heart English Bible
"Do not let your heart be troubled. Believe in God. Believe also in me.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English
“Let not your heart be troubled. Believe in God and believe in me.”
Genetic fallacy doesn't rule the issue.
Recovery Version:
"Do not let your heart be troubled, Believe into God, believe also into Me."
New American Standard 1977
“Let not your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me.
Jubilee Bible 2000
Let not your heart be troubled; ye believe in God, believe also in me.
King James 2000 Bible
Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me.
American King James Version
Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me.
American Standard Version
Let not your heart be troubled: believe in God, believe also in me.
Douay-Rheims Bible
LET not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in me.
Darby Bible Translation
Let not your heart be troubled; ye believe on God, believe also on me.
English Revised Version
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
Webster's Bible Translation
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
Weymouth New Testament
"Let not your hearts be troubled. Trust in God: trust in me also.
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John 14;2 some other English translations or paraphrases:
New International Version
My Father's house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?
New Living Translation
There is more than enough room in my Father's home. If this were not so, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?
English Standard Version
In my Father’s house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you?
Berean Study Bible
In My Father's house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?
Berean Literal Bible
In My Father's house there are many mansions. And if not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you?
New American Standard Bible
"In My Father's house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you.
King James Bible
In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
In My Father's house are many dwelling places; if not, I would have told you. I am going away to prepare a place for you.
International Standard Version
There are many rooms in my Father's house. If there weren't, I wouldn't have told you that I am going away to prepare a place for you, would I?
NET Bible
There are many dwelling places in my Father's house. Otherwise, I would have told you, because I am going away to make ready a place for you.
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2 edits
Recovery Version:
"In My Father's house are many abodes ..."
The Greek word translated "abodes" is the plural form of the same word used in John 14:23
"Jesus answered and said to him, If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word, and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make an ABODE with him." (John 14:23)
In His Father's house are many ABODES [plural] which are those with whom in verse 23 He comes to make AN ABODE [singular] in them with His Father.
27 Jan 18
2 edits
Originally posted by @sonshipFocus jaywill.
[b]John 14;2 some other English translations or paraphrases:
[/b]
New International Version
My Father's house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?
New Living Translation
There is more than enough room in my Father's home. If this were not so, would I ...[text shortened]... herwise, I would have told you, because I am going away to make ready a place for you.
DG was speaking of John 14:6 in particular.
Your explanation of John 14:5-6 is so convoluted that, evidently, you are unable to keep things straight in your mind.
Do you really think this Rube Goldberg theology of yours isn't a convoluted mess?
You've not only made John 14:5-6 much more complicated than it is, you've completely missed the meaning of Jesus' words.
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Originally posted by @thinkofoneProve rather why the "convoluted" explanations are incorrect.
Focus jaywill.
DG was speaking of John 14:6.
Your explanation of John 14:5-6 is so convoluted that, evidently, you are unable to keep things straight in your mind.
Do you really think this Rube Goldberg theology of yours isn't a convoluted mess?
You never read or never took seriously that Paul said the church is the habitation of God in spirit.
Of course you didn't because "Jesus when He walked on earth" is your way of saying you reject most of the New Testament in unbelief.
Being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the chief cornerstone,
In whom all the building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord;
IN whom you also are being built together into a dwelling place of God in spirit." (Eph. 2:20-22)
Christ came to build the church, the temple of God, the habitation of God in spirit. This is remarkably the same as Paul's teaching of the new covenant church being the house of God.
What is profound you jeer away as convoluted.
But we see no better alternative analysis from you or Ghost-of-Duke, do we ?
27 Jan 18
Originally posted by @sonship'When tempted, no one should say, God is tempting me. For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt.' ( James 1:13)
Prove rather why the "convoluted" explanations are incorrect.
You never read or never took seriously that Paul said the church is the habitation of God in spirit.
Of course you didn't because "Jesus when He walked on earth" is your way of saying you reject most of the [b]New Testament in unbelief.
[quote] Being built upon the foundatio ...[text shortened]... way as convoluted.
But we see no better alternative analysis from you or Ghost-of-Duke, do we ?
Jesus, of course, was tempted in every way possible. The reason why perhaps he said, “don’t call me good, none are good, only God.”
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Okay, so we have some customery objection from the tag team Ghost & ToO.
Well, in the very same Gospel of John, Jesus has already strongly implied that He is the reality of Bethel the house of God (Genesis 28) .
Bethel means the house of God.
In John chapter 1 He already gave us heads up that that symbol of the house of God - Bethel in Genesis 28 of Jacob's vision pointed to Himself.
"And He said to him, Truly, truly, I say to you, You will see heaven opened and the angels of God ascending and descending on the Son of Man." (John 1:51)
To understand what Jesus was referring to you must read about Jacob's dream of the ladder set up on the earth reaching up to Heaven and that place being the dreadful jhouse of God.
Read Genesis 28:10-22.
How about with some real prayer for understanding from accompanying.
27 Jan 18
2 edits
Originally posted by @sonshipPresumably the impetus for this thread came from our discussion in the "The Only Sin that God Cannot Forgive" thread.
Prove rather why the "convoluted" explanations are incorrect.
You never read or never took seriously that Paul said the church is the habitation of God in spirit.
Of course you didn't because "Jesus when He walked on earth" is your way of saying you reject most of the [b]New Testament in unbelief.
[quote] Being built upon the foundatio ...[text shortened]... way as convoluted.
But we see no better alternative analysis from you or Ghost-of-Duke, do we ?
There I posted the following:
"[In John 14:5-6] Jesus is speaking of the gospel that He preached during His ministry.He is speaking of the words He spoke while He walked the Earth."
To that I'll add:
The words that Jesus spoke when he preached His Gospel during His ministry ARE "the way, and the truth, and the life". No one comes to the Father but through "the way, and the truth, and the life".
That's it in a nutshell.
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Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeBut Jesus is God and man.
'When tempted, no one should say, God is tempting me. For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt.' ( James 1:13)
Jesus, of course, was tempted in every way possible. The reason why perhaps he said, “don’t call me good, none are good, only God.”
That is what incarnation means.
And to say that only God is good means that if you are going to call Jesus "Good Master" you have to admit that the man is God.
Incarnation means God and man are mingled as one.
And John 14 is His announcement that He goes to the cross that all those redeemed by Him may also enjoy this mingling of God and humanity.
It agrees with His mighty prayer that His people be with Him where He is and behold His glory as co-enjoyers of that reality in eternity.
"Father, concerning that which You have given Me, I desire that they also may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory, which You have given Me, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world." (John 17:24)
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Originally posted by @thinkofoneThe proof that Jesus is speaking of coming to them in RESURRECTION is in the very same chapter and general section of John's Gospel.
[
Ie.
"I will not leave you as orphans, I am coming to you.
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer, but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live.
In that day you will know that I am in My Father and you in Me and I in you." (John 14:18-20)
He will die and the world will see Him no longer.
But He will resurrect and in His form as "the Spirit of reality" (v.17) the Holy Spirit as "Another Comforter" He will come with His Father to make an abode with His redeemed believers (v. 23).
Because He lives in resurrection they too will live. In that day of His resurrection they will know that they are mingled with God.
The Father, they know then, He as a man is in. And they will know they are in Him, and they will know that He is in them. That is a mingling. That is a blending of the Triune God with His redeemed people.
He will not leave His disciples as orphans either by dying or going away in any other sense. He will become their very spiritual life. Because He lives in resurrection they too will live in oneness with Him.
27 Jan 18
Originally posted by @sonshipHow does this address my post?
But Jesus is God and man.
That is what incarnation means.
And to say that only God is good means that if you are going to call Jesus [b]"Good Master" you have to admit that the man is God.
Incarnation means God and man are mingled as one.
And John 14 is His announcement that He goes to the cross that all those redeemed by Him may [i ...[text shortened]... have given Me, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world." (John 17:24) [/b] [/quote][/b]
'When tempted, no one should say, God is tempting me. For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt.' ( James 1:13)
Jesus, of course, was tempted in every way possible. The reason why perhaps he said, “don’t call me good, none are good, only God.”
If the mingling of God and man results in weakness before temptation then it logically follows that human frailty is greater than divine resilience.
27 Jan 18
1 edit
Originally posted by @sonshipLooks like you used "Reply and Quote", but then edited out all the text. Since nothing in your response indicates it was in response to my latest post, I'll post it again here:
The proof that Jesus is speaking of coming to them in [b]RESURRECTION is in the very same chapter and general section of John's Gospel.
Ie.
[quote] "I will not leave you as orphans, I am coming to you.
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer, but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live.
In that day you will know ...[text shortened]... ir very spiritual life. Because He lives in resurrection they too will live in oneness with Him.
Presumably the impetus for this thread came from our discussion in the "The Only Sin that God Cannot Forgive" thread.
There I posted the following:
"[In John 14:5-6] Jesus is speaking of the gospel that He preached during His ministry.He is speaking of the words He spoke while He walked the Earth."
To that I'll add:
The words that Jesus spoke when he preached His Gospel during His ministry ARE "the way, and the truth, and the life". No one comes to the Father but through "the way, and the truth, and the life".
That's it in a nutshell.
Jaywill, it really is that simple. That's Jesus' point in John 14:5-6
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Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
'When tempted, no one should say, God is tempting me. For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt.' ( James 1:13)
Jesus, of course, was tempted in every way possible. The reason why perhaps he said, “don’t call me good, none are good, only God.”
Jesus, of course, was tempted in every way possible. The reason why perhaps he said, “don’t call me good, none are good, only God.”
Yes, Jesus as a man was tempted in all respects like us yet without sin. And because He is the spotless, perfect man He is qualified to be our spotless Lamb of God for the offering which justifies sinners eternally.
No one comes to the Father except through Him.
You and I can only enter into God because He as the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world (John 1:29) went to His cross to accomplish redemption for people.
Men and women will draw close to God only because of the work of Jesus Christ and not on their own merit. He had to go an prepare a place for us, a standing in God, a way from God to come as Spirit into our spirit.
Originally posted by @sonshipHey jaywill, just in case you're still around, I posted a response to your latest post to me just before you posted your response to GoaD
The proof that Jesus is speaking of coming to them in [b]RESURRECTION is in the very same chapter and general section of John's Gospel.
Ie.
[quote] "I will not leave you as orphans, I am coming to you.
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer, but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live.
In that day you will know ...[text shortened]... ir very spiritual life. Because He lives in resurrection they too will live in oneness with Him.