06 Nov 11
Luke 24:12: "Then arose Peter, and ran unto the sepulchre; and stooping down, he beheld the linen clothes laid by themselves, and departed, wondering in himself at that which was come to pass."
othonion; "the linen clothes" g3608
1) a piece of linen, small linen cloth
2) strips of linen cloth for swathing the dead
definition 1 does not apply in context, we must use definition 2.
John 19:40 "Then took they the body of Jesus, and wound it in linen clothes with the spices, as the manner of the Jews is to bury."
othonion; "in linen clothes" g3608
once again, referring to strips of linen cloth.
John 20:6-7: "Then cometh Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and seeth the linen clothes lie,"
othonion; "linen clothes" g3608
once again, referring to strips of linen cloth.
no problems in translation, only problem in cognitive dissonance.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by VoidSpiritI get mine from http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/
oh yes, let's type every verse and ignore that they are available with a quick search, copy and paste. i'm sure that all the christians here type every verse without ever coping and pasting from online sources.
they are such cute little saints, these christians. always diligently typing the verses.
I might type them out, but I might get them wrong, too, and we are exhorted not to add or remove words from God's scripture lest our name be removed from the book of life.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by Suziannenot too bad. i don't think there is a better source than the blue letter myself.
I get mine from http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/
I might type them out, but I might get them wrong, too, and we are exhorted not to add or remove words from God's scripture lest our name be removed from the book of life.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/
though it defaults to KJV, this one has everything you could need right at your fingertips; , translation versions, lexicons, commentaries, co-relations and dictionary aids.
06 Nov 11
1 edit
Originally posted by VoidSpiritShroud usually refers to an item, such as a cloth, that covers or protects
Luke 24:12: "Then arose Peter, and ran unto the sepulchre; and stooping down, he beheld the [b]linen clothes laid by themselves, and departed, wondering in himself at that which was come to pass."
othonion; "the linen clothes" g3608
1) a piece of linen, small linen cloth
2) strips of linen cloth for swathing the dead
definition 1 does n of linen cloth.
no problems in translation, only problem in cognitive dissonance.[/b]
some other object. The term is most often used in reference to burial sheets,
winding-cloths or winding-sheets, such as the famous Shroud of Turin or
Tachrichim (burial shrouds) that Jews are dressed in for burial. Traditionally,
burial shrouds are made of white cotton, wool or linen, though any material
can be used so long as it is made of natural fibre.
P.S. I pointed out before, "othonion" is singular and means a piece of linen.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by SuzianneNot that I would ever be caught dead defending an atheist
Not that I would ever be caught dead defending an atheist, but VS at least has the verses correct, and he even uses the KJV, which is my translation of choice.
One can only hope, that if he can present these few verses as portraying the truth, perhaps it's not so far a trek to consider other verses in the Bible as also portraying truth.
Not that I eve ...[text shortened]... e Son, and my salvation does not rest on a single piece of cloth, be it 2000 years old, or 500.
What a curiously revealing statement about you. I'd more than happily defend you if i thought you were correct.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by sumydidHow do you know what Jesus looks like? Have you seen a photo.
I'm kind of indifferent on it. The implications are pretty obvious. The figure looks like Jesus, etc. But I've been focusing primarily on the evidence against it, and so far none of it has held up to close scrutiny.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by Proper KnobAs would I, but guess what?
[b]Not that I would ever be caught dead defending an atheist
What a curiously revealing statement about you. I'd more than happily defend you if i thought you were correct.[/b]
By your own definition, an atheist is defined by his very disbelief in God. That means that, no matter how you twist it, he's always going to be wrong.
I'd defend you IF you were correct, but you'd have to come to my side to be correct. And that means no longer being an atheist, by definition.
06 Nov 11
1 edit
Originally posted by VoidSpiritThanks for the link, I will check it out as soon as I can.
not too bad. i don't think there is a better source than the blue letter myself.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/
though it defaults to KJV, this one has everything you could need right at your fingertips; , translation versions, lexicons, commentaries, co-relations and dictionary aids.
Edit: This site is quite extraordinary. I've been rather disenchanted really with the lame search features of the KJBO website. BLB is a revelation. Thanks again.
06 Nov 11
1 edit
Originally posted by SuzianneWhat a pompous, arrogant [insert any word you wish in here] you are. When it actually boils down to it, your just as big a fundamentalist as the other loonies on this site.
As would I, but guess what?
By your own definition, an atheist is defined by his very disbelief in God. That means that, no matter how you twist it, he's always going to be wrong.
I'd defend you IF you were correct, but you'd have to come to my side to be correct. And that means no longer being an atheist, by definition.
06 Nov 11
2 edits
Originally posted by Proper Knob/shrug
What a pompous, arrogant [insert any word you wish in here] you are. When it actually boils down to it, your just as big a fundamentalist as the other loonies on this site.
If you think I'm an ass for this viewpoint, just wait until you face the God you've rejected.
It is what it is.
Edit: The difference is, when you finish talking to me, you can still repent and change your destiny.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by SuziannePoint proven.
/shrug
If you think I'm an ass for this viewpoint, just wait until you face the God you've rejected.
It is what it is.
Smug, that's the word i was thinking of before. I notice it's much more a feature of the American Christians on this forum than any others. It's that whole 'Us vs Them' attitude that seems to permeate America.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by Proper KnobI know. It is called "the ugly American", right?
Point proven.
Smug, that's the word i was thinking of before. I notice it's much more a feature of the American Christians on this forum than any others. It's that whole 'Us vs Them' attitude that seems to permeate America.
06 Nov 11
2 edits
Originally posted by Proper Knobits a really interesting point, I wonder what factors have led to such a kind of siege
Point proven.
Smug, that's the word i was thinking of before. I notice it's much more a feature of the American Christians on this forum than any others. It's that whole 'Us vs Them' attitude that seems to permeate America.
mentality? I like Americans but i have noticed that they can be terribly right wing.
How was this mentality formed? I really wonder. One would think that being Christian
one should have an even more sensitive approach to the plight of others and a real
sense of social injustices, but its just the opposite, their experience, rather than having
made them more empathetic, seems to have hardened them. I should read a few
books on the subject.
06 Nov 11
Originally posted by Proper KnobAs does your incorrect assumption that there is no God resemble a certain "smugness". You assume that I'm just being a pompous ass because of this (to you) weird idea that you're going to pay a heavy price for your disbelief. Do you think I'm making it all up? Do you seriously think I'm holding myself up as a paragon of virtue while calling you scum of the earth while giggling up my sleeve? Do you think I'm telling you a fable to scare you into being righteous? I don't know you. It shouldn't matter to me what happens to you, and it definitely wouldn't matter to me, IF I had this attitude you've assigned to me. All I can do is be straight with you, tell you how it is, without embellishment and hope that if you don't like the sound of it you make changes. Why? Because I get more points on my Christian Frequent Flyer card? No. It's because as Christians, we are exhorted to Love thy Neighbor as thyself. I'm glad someone woke me up to God's plan for me when I was in college, and I've led many to Christ since then. It's the least I can do. There are many in this world leading lives that are marching them straight down into perdition. But it's even worse for atheists because they are rejecting the only thing that will save them, Christ's sacrifice on the cross. I pray daily that those who are blind are led to the light. And yes, I do mean atheists.
Point proven.
Smug, that's the word i was thinking of before. I notice it's much more a feature of the American Christians on this forum than any others. It's that whole 'Us vs Them' attitude that seems to permeate America.
Like I said, it is what it is. Nothing more, nothing less.
06 Nov 11
1 edit
Originally posted by SuzianneAs does your incorrect assumption that there is no God resemble a certain "smugness".
As does your incorrect assumption that there is no God resemble a certain "smugness". You assume that I'm just being a pompous ass because of this (to you) weird idea that you're going to pay a heavy price for your disbelief. Do you think I'm making it all up? Do you seriously think I'm holding myself up as a paragon of virtue while calling you scum of t mean atheists.
Like I said, it is what it is. Nothing more, nothing less.
The lunacy of this opening sentence says it all. This what you said in an earlier post
This supports my claim that there IS no proof of God. It's not possible.
So there is, by your own admission, no proof of God, and yet i'm smug for choosing not to believe whilst you are correct for believing. Righto 🙄🙄
I call you smug and arrogant for your continual disparaging comments about people who don't share belief in God, of which you've stated more than once there is no evidence for -
By your own definition, an atheist is defined by his very disbelief in God. That means that, no matter how you twist it, he's always going to be wrong. I'd defend you IF you were correct, but you'd have to come to my side to be correct. And that means no longer being an atheist, by definition.
A lazy atheist. Who'd've guessed?
What is more telling is that all of the arguments he presented were previously brought up in this forum by atheists. So much for "believing" in the Christ.
And that's just today, i'm sure a search of your posting history would reveal more. As for this -
Do you seriously think I'm holding myself up as a paragon of virtue while calling you scum of the earth while giggling up my sleeve?
Maybe not giggling up your sleeve, but yes, that's how you come across.